Regression: Grease Pencil: Drawing lines appear after releasing the mouse #102251

New Issue

System Information
Operating system: macOS-13.0-x86_64-i386-64bit 64 Bits
Graphics card: AMD Radeon Pro 580 OpenGL Engine ATI Technologies Inc. 4.1 ATI-4.9.48

Blender Version
Broken: version: 3.4.0 Beta, branch: master, commit date: 2022-11-03 13:32, hash: 09b9e1e95e
Worked: Blender 3.4 Beta some days ago

Caused by 0ee9282b5c

Short description of error

Exact steps for others to reproduce the error

Use the 2D template
Draw something on the canvas
While drawing I only see the cursor. The line appears a short time after releasing the mouse

system-info.txt

**System Information** Operating system: macOS-13.0-x86_64-i386-64bit 64 Bits Graphics card: AMD Radeon Pro 580 OpenGL Engine ATI Technologies Inc. 4.1 ATI-4.9.48 **Blender Version** Broken: version: 3.4.0 Beta, branch: master, commit date: 2022-11-03 13:32, hash: `09b9e1e95e` Worked: Blender 3.4 Beta some days ago Caused by 0ee9282b5c **Short description of error** **Exact steps for others to reproduce the error** 1. Use the 2D template 2. Draw something on the canvas 3. While drawing I only see the cursor. The line appears a short time after releasing the mouse [system-info.txt](https://archive.blender.org/developer/F13850118/system-info.txt)

Added subscriber: @pixeltrain3d

#103769 was marked as duplicate of this issue

#103240 was marked as duplicate of this issue

#103157 was marked as duplicate of this issue

#103123 was marked as duplicate of this issue

#103017 was marked as duplicate of this issue

#102823 was marked as duplicate of this issue

Added subscriber: @Alexander-Hartmann

Added subscriber: @PratikPB2123

Changed status from 'Needs Triage' to: 'Needs User Info'

Hi, thanks for the report. Are you using tablet connected to your main machine for drawing?
I'm not able to reproduce this in 3.5 (ecda9483f1f8a0aa6f05bd194e72a06889d27642)
Did you try factory reset?: {nav File > Default > Load Factory Settings}
Are you able to reproduce with default draw tool of Grease pencil?

Hi, thanks for the report. Are you using tablet connected to your main machine for drawing? I'm not able to reproduce this in 3.5 (`ecda9483f1f8a0aa6f05bd194e72a06889d27642`) Did you try factory reset?: {nav File > Default > Load Factory Settings} Are you able to reproduce with default draw tool of Grease pencil?

I now deleted the preference folder.
No tablet attached, only my 3dconnexion mouse.
Started Blender -> 2D template
I draw directly with the default Brush.

Still the same behavior.

I use the 3.4_release branch from today. system-info.txt attached

P.S. Tested it now with Blender 3.5 (master), same behavior

I now deleted the preference folder. No tablet attached, only my 3dconnexion mouse. Started Blender -> 2D template I draw directly with the default Brush. Still the same behavior. I use the 3.4_release branch from today. system-info.txt attached P.S. Tested it now with Blender 3.5 (master), same behavior

system-info.txt

[system-info.txt](https://archive.blender.org/developer/F13854304/system-info.txt)

Changed status from 'Needs User Info' to: 'Needs Triage'

Added subscriber: @Nurb2Kea

I can confirm this behaviour.

Screen Recording 2022-11-04 at 1.28.26pm.mp4

I can confirm this behaviour. [Screen Recording 2022-11-04 at 1.28.26pm.mp4](https://archive.blender.org/developer/F13854746/Screen_Recording_2022-11-04_at_1.28.26pm.mp4) ![System.jpg](https://archive.blender.org/developer/F13854747/System.jpg)

probably an AMD problem, on a MacMini M1 it works without errors
system-info.txt

Do the settings for "Cycles Render Devices" affect 2D? Have you also tried with "None"?

probably an **AMD problem**, on a MacMini M1 it works without errors [system-info.txt](https://archive.blender.org/developer/F13855330/system-info.txt) Do the settings for "Cycles Render Devices" affect 2D? Have you also tried with "None"? ![Bildschirmfoto 2022-11-04 um 17.39.14.png](https://archive.blender.org/developer/F13855340/Bildschirm_foto_2022-11-04_um_17.39.14.png)

No, doesn't make a difference. I tested before adding the Metal device and after. Same result!

In #102251#1440990, @Alexander-Hartmann wrote:
probably an AMD problem, on a MacMini M1 it works without errors
system-info.txt

Do the settings for "Cycles Render Devices" affect 2D? Have you also tried with "None"?

Nope. When switching off AMD and only use CPU it's the same...even worst.
Also when I got it right you're using M1 and not INTEL !!

> In #102251#1440990, @Alexander-Hartmann wrote: > probably an **AMD problem**, on a MacMini M1 it works without errors > [system-info.txt](https://archive.blender.org/developer/F13855330/system-info.txt) > > Do the settings for "Cycles Render Devices" affect 2D? Have you also tried with "None"? > > ![Bildschirmfoto 2022-11-04 um 17.39.14.png](https://archive.blender.org/developer/F13855340/Bildschirm_foto_2022-11-04_um_17.39.14.png) Nope. When switching off AMD and only use CPU it's the same...even worst. Also when I got it right you're using M1 and not INTEL !!

My system is INTEL ... with AMD Radeon Pro 580

In #102251#1440994, @pixeltrain3d wrote:
My system is INTEL ... with AMD Radeon Pro 580

Look close, I quoted Alexander Hartmann and told him that he uses a M1 unlike us with INTEL... :-)

> In #102251#1440994, @pixeltrain3d wrote: > My system is INTEL ... with AMD Radeon Pro 580 Look close, I quoted Alexander Hartmann and told him that he uses a M1 unlike us with INTEL... :-)

Worked: Blender 3.4 Beta some days ago
Maybe a connection to using Mac OS X 13 Ventura?

If you find time please try version 3.3, if it still doesn't work then maybe it's Mac OS X 13 Ventura.
What’s new in Metal 3: https://developer.apple.com/metal/

I am currently trying to familiarize myself with MacOS development. Many bugs that have been reported mostly affect AMD graphics cards. Unfortunately I don't have a Mac with an AMD graphics card to check the problems.

I see there are also drivers for Mac on the AMD support site, but I'm not an expert, so if you're unfamiliar with AMD drivers, please don't try. :-)
https://www.amd.com/de/support

I still have a Mac Mini (2014) with Intel and without an AMD GPU, MacOS Version 12.6.1, too old for Version 13.
After 2 hours the Blender sources were compiled to 65% :-D
Tomorrow I'll check "Grease Pencil" there too.

>Worked: Blender 3.4 Beta some days ago >Maybe a connection to using Mac OS X 13 Ventura? If you find time please try version 3.3, if it still doesn't work then maybe it's Mac OS X 13 Ventura. What’s new in Metal 3: https://developer.apple.com/metal/ I am currently trying to familiarize myself with MacOS development. Many bugs that have been reported mostly affect AMD graphics cards. Unfortunately I don't have a Mac with an AMD graphics card to check the problems. I see there are also drivers for Mac on the AMD support site, but I'm not an expert, so if you're unfamiliar with AMD drivers, please don't try. :-) https://www.amd.com/de/support ![Bildschirmfoto 2022-11-04 um 22.37.34.png](https://archive.blender.org/developer/F13856426/Bildschirm_foto_2022-11-04_um_22.37.34.png) I still have a Mac Mini (2014) with Intel and without an AMD GPU, MacOS Version 12.6.1, too old for Version 13. After 2 hours the Blender sources were compiled to 65% :-D Tomorrow I'll check "Grease Pencil" there too.

@Alexander-Hartmann

First of all, we are talking version 3.4 ( IN DEVELOPMENT ) here and not older versions.
At the moment we are in 3.5 alpha already.
The devs changed a lot and 3.4 has this issue now, what could happen when developing forward!

Your ideas with all honor, but you are blowing up this bugreport with something you're not an expert with, like you said.
Just leave it as is, and some savvy developer dev will have a look and fix it.

We delivered all we can to nail down the problem for the devs incl. videos, logs, etc...
Your guessing won't help here and we are well aware of all the technical mac specifics like graphics, driver, ......

Thanks

@Alexander-Hartmann First of all, we are talking version 3.4 ( IN DEVELOPMENT ) here and not older versions. At the moment we are in 3.5 alpha already. The devs changed a lot and 3.4 has this issue now, what could happen when developing forward! Your ideas with all honor, but you are blowing up this bugreport with something you're not an expert with, like you said. Just leave it as is, and some savvy developer dev will have a look and fix it. We delivered all we can to nail down the problem for the devs incl. videos, logs, etc... Your guessing won't help here and we are well aware of all the technical mac specifics like graphics, driver, ...... Thanks

Excuse me, that wasn't my intention.

I have 20 years of professional experience as a software developer. (Windows, Web, Android and some iOS)
This is our procedure to eliminate possible errors. Check where it works and where it doesn't.

not reproducible on a MacMini (2014)
system-info.txt

renderer: 'Intel Iris OpenGL Engine'
vendor: 'Intel Inc.'
version: '4.1 INTEL-18.8.5'
device type: 'INTEL'
backend type: 'OPENGL'

Excuse me, that wasn't my intention. I have 20 years of professional experience as a software developer. (Windows, Web, Android and some iOS) This is our procedure to eliminate possible errors. Check where it works and where it doesn't. not reproducible on a MacMini (2014) [system-info.txt](https://archive.blender.org/developer/F13856633/system-info.txt) > renderer: 'Intel Iris OpenGL Engine' > vendor: 'Intel Inc.' > version: '4.1 INTEL-18.8.5' > device type: 'INTEL' > backend type: 'OPENGL'

@Alexander-Hartmann

We are talking version 3.4 and it's still in development.
It works on version 3.3 but that's for sure, because otherwise we would have had this bugreport a month or two ago...!!
It works on M1 (totally different system (graphics and CPU wise)) but not ON Intel CPU or GPU with factory settings and no special periphery . As we tried it makes no difference if you use AMD or the CPU with metal or not. On macOS 13 Ventura.
This we know since my test above. Same behaviour on two different Intel Mac's with blender 3.4
And we are not looking for a version where blender works as expected, we are looking for a solution for 3.4.

No need to excuse yourself. But I spend almost a year just watching how the blender devs work, before I make them uncomfortable reading a mile long bugreport.

We give the devs what they need to know (ask for) and nothing else, otherwise it will take ages!

I will stop answering you now, because ...
nuff said

THX

@Alexander-Hartmann - We are talking version 3.4 and it's still in development. - It works on version 3.3 but that's for sure, because otherwise we would have had this bugreport a month or two ago...!! - It works on M1 (totally different system (graphics and CPU wise)) but not ON Intel CPU or GPU with factory settings and no special periphery . As we tried it makes no difference if you use AMD or the CPU with metal or not. On macOS 13 Ventura. This we know since my test above. Same behaviour on two different Intel Mac's with blender 3.4 And we are not looking for a version where blender works as expected, we are looking for a solution for 3.4. No need to excuse yourself. But I spend almost a year just watching how the blender devs work, before I make them uncomfortable reading a mile long bugreport. We give the devs what they need to know (ask for) and nothing else, otherwise it will take ages! I will stop answering you now, because ... nuff said THX

Hi Pratik Borhade @PratikPB2123 ,
any news on that bug. It's a showstopper for me and it seems, that other users here in the thread have the same behavior?
Can we provide more info to get this investigated or "confirmed"? Thanks

Hi Pratik Borhade @PratikPB2123 , any news on that bug. It's a showstopper for me and it seems, that other users here in the thread have the same behavior? Can we provide more info to get this investigated or "confirmed"? Thanks

Added subscriber: @iss

@iss, can you check in your mac device?

Changed status from 'Needs Triage' to: 'Confirmed'

Can reproduce, will bisect.
Though last working version seems incorrect - first 3.4 beta build is not working still. Will bisect from last good alpha

Can reproduce, will bisect. Though last working version seems incorrect - first 3.4 beta build is not working still. Will bisect from last good alpha

Added subscriber: @fclem

Caused by 0ee9282b5c
CC @fclem

Caused by 0ee9282b5c51066dfcf5a6c7a5ebcd3dd5290673 CC @fclem

Added subscriber: @Jeroen-Bakker

Not reproducable on mac-m1 or intel, so might be Apple/AMD specific.

Added subscriber: @LenWhite

Added subscriber: @GerritOne

Reproducible on blender-3.4.0-candidate+v34.1017b493edb9-darwin.x86_64-release running on
Intel Mac Laptop with AMD Radeon Pro 5500M graphics.

In addition I attached eGPU running with AMD Radeon RX 57000 XT and produced the same result -> Drawing lines appear after releasing the mouse

Reproducible on blender-3.4.0-candidate+v34.1017b493edb9-darwin.x86_64-release running on Intel Mac Laptop with AMD Radeon Pro 5500M graphics. In addition I attached eGPU running with AMD Radeon RX 57000 XT and produced the same result -> Drawing lines appear after releasing the mouse

Added subscriber: @Blastus_Jones

Can confirm here too. 3.4 alpha, 3.5alpha, and 3.4 release all have the same problem; stroke doesn't appear until after mouse/pen is released.

Mac Pro 16 core
Radeon Pro W5700X
Ventura 13.0.1

It did work before, most likely prior to the Ventura install, but GP is the main thing I switched to blender for, and now all my work is at a standstill. :-/

Can confirm here too. 3.4 alpha, 3.5alpha, and 3.4 release all have the same problem; stroke doesn't appear until after mouse/pen is released. Mac Pro 16 core Radeon Pro W5700X Ventura 13.0.1 It did work before, most likely prior to the Ventura install, but GP is the main thing I switched to blender for, and now all my work is at a standstill. :-/

Added subscriber: @BrianORiordan

Same problem happening for me.

Added subscriber: @StuMcG

Same here. Works perfect in 3.31... 3.4 no deals...

Same here. Works perfect in 3.31... 3.4 no deals... ![image.png](https://archive.blender.org/developer/F14052792/image.png)

Added subscribers: @jnuotio, @dbarch

Added subscriber: @PepeSanchez

Added subscriber: @Toba

I confirm the issue (blender 3.4), hope this will help:

system-info.txt

I confirm the issue (blender 3.4), hope this will help: ![Screenshot 2022-12-13 at 17.53.11.png](https://archive.blender.org/developer/F14055871/Screenshot_2022-12-13_at_17.53.11.png) [system-info.txt](https://archive.blender.org/developer/F14055870/system-info.txt)

Removed subscriber: @Alexander-Hartmann

Added subscriber: @ramamoorthi

Added subscriber: @Mosky

Same issue here
Blender 3.4.0

[EDIT]
And can also confirm this issue is not present in 3.3.2!

Same issue here Blender 3.4.0 ![Screenshot 2022-12-16 at 12.05.45.png](https://archive.blender.org/developer/F14062264/Screenshot_2022-12-16_at_12.05.45.png) [EDIT] And can also confirm this issue is not present in 3.3.2!

Same exact issue for 3.4.1 sorry to say...

Mac Pro 16 core
Radeon Pro W5700X
Ventura 13.0.1

Same exact issue for 3.4.1 sorry to say... Mac Pro 16 core Radeon Pro W5700X Ventura 13.0.1

Added subscriber: @Matt_HH

Added subscriber: @Chillx

I'm having the same issue on my MacBook pro. Grease Pencil stroke does not show up until I lift the pen up, or release the mouse button. I figured I'd report it here. Exact same issue as the video posted above by Guido.

Model: MacBook Pro (16-inch, 2019)
Processor: 2.6 GHz 6-Core Intel Core i7
Graphics: AMD Radeon Pro 5300M 4 GB
OS: macOS Monterey 12.5 (21G72)
Blender Version: 3.4.0 production release.

I'm having the same issue on my MacBook pro. Grease Pencil stroke does not show up until I lift the pen up, or release the mouse button. I figured I'd report it here. Exact same issue as the video posted above by Guido. Model: MacBook Pro (16-inch, 2019) Processor: 2.6 GHz 6-Core Intel Core i7 Graphics: AMD Radeon Pro 5300M 4 GB OS: macOS Monterey 12.5 (21G72) Blender Version: 3.4.0 production release.

Added subscriber: @Cinema4D

Hi,

I'm using MacOs Monterey 12.4. (21F79) on a Hackintosh.

The bug is not present in 3.4.0 Alpha
However in 3.4.1 Stable and 3.5 Alpha it is present.

Things I tried, which don't make a difference:
rebooting, factory presets, disabling all plugins, switching to wirefreme/solid/preview/rendered, switching render-engine to evee/cycles/workbench, using my mouse instead of my tablet.

For now I'm fine using the 3.4 Alpha for Grease Pencil, but this issue makes the tool unusable.

Setup:
3,6 GHz 8-Core Intel Core i9, 32 GB 3200 MHz DDR4, MD Radeon RX 5500 XT 8 GB

Hi, I'm using MacOs Monterey 12.4. (21F79) on a Hackintosh. The bug is not present in 3.4.0 Alpha However in 3.4.1 Stable and 3.5 Alpha it is present. **Things I tried, which don't make a difference:** rebooting, factory presets, disabling all plugins, switching to wirefreme/solid/preview/rendered, switching render-engine to evee/cycles/workbench, using my mouse instead of my tablet. For now I'm fine using the 3.4 Alpha for Grease Pencil, but this issue makes the tool unusable. **Setup:** 3,6 GHz 8-Core Intel Core i9, 32 GB 3200 MHz DDR4, MD Radeon RX 5500 XT 8 GB

Added subscriber: @RunningWolf

System Information
Operating system: macOS-13.1-x86_64-i386-64bit 64 Bits
Graphics card: AMD Radeon Pro 560X OpenGL Engine ATI Technologies Inc. 4.1 ATI-4.9.51

Blender Version
Working: version: 3.3.0, branch: master, commit date: 2022-09-06 15:39, hash: 0759f671ce

Short description of error
I reinstalled older and older versions of Blender until one worked and this one works find with Grease Pencil. The Draw tool shows the line while drawing, even when using a tablet.

**System Information** Operating system: macOS-13.1-x86_64-i386-64bit 64 Bits Graphics card: AMD Radeon Pro 560X OpenGL Engine ATI Technologies Inc. 4.1 ATI-4.9.51 **Blender Version** Working: version: 3.3.0, branch: master, commit date: 2022-09-06 15:39, hash: `0759f671ce` **Short description of error** I reinstalled older and older versions of Blender until one worked and this one works find with Grease Pencil. The Draw tool shows the line while drawing, even when using a tablet.

Hi all,

In Blender 3.5 there is a Metal backend. Can anyone test this issue on Blender 3.5 with Metal enabled. Metal can be enabled in Preferences -> System in the GPU Backend panel.

OpenGL errors on Mac are very hard to solve as there are no debugging tools to detect what is actually going on. If we can reproduce it with the Metal backend it could help to pin-point the issue.

Jeroen

Hi all, In Blender 3.5 there is a Metal backend. Can anyone test this issue on Blender 3.5 with Metal enabled. Metal can be enabled in Preferences -> System in the GPU Backend panel. OpenGL errors on Mac are very hard to solve as there are no debugging tools to detect what is actually going on. If we can reproduce it with the Metal backend it could help to pin-point the issue. Jeroen

Can not reproduce with metal backend

Using Metal backend in Blender 3.5 and can not reproduce error.

I had the error before with the OpenGL backend.
With the Metal backend it works fine!

I had the error before with the OpenGL backend. With the Metal backend it works fine!

Lowering the priority to normal.
Although in OpenGL this still isn't solved. macOS OpenGL support is deprecated and can have special bugs. Due to no debugging tools are available on macOs it is very hard to detect the actual issue.
We currently have a work-around (use Metal backend). Currenlty still in discussion if we want to make the metal backend default for the upcoming release.

Lowering the priority to normal. Although in OpenGL this still isn't solved. macOS OpenGL support is deprecated and can have special bugs. Due to no debugging tools are available on macOs it is very hard to detect the actual issue. We currently have a work-around (use Metal backend). Currenlty still in discussion if we want to make the metal backend default for the upcoming release.

I guess I have no choice but update MacOS from Catalina to Ventura if I want to use the new blender's features?

![Screenshot 2023-01-12 at 11.35.24.png](https://archive.blender.org/developer/F14145123/Screenshot_2023-01-12_at_11.35.24.png) I guess I have no choice but update MacOS from Catalina to Ventura if I want to use the new blender's features?

Having the same issue described above. (Tested with 3.4.1. - 3.5 Alpha)
Not being a Mac user, the Metal work-around isn't an alternative for me, I suppose..

System specs:

Windows 10 Version 21H2
Graphics: AMD Radeon RX6700 XT
CPU: AMD Ryzen 7 3700X 8-Core

Having the same issue described above. (Tested with 3.4.1. - 3.5 Alpha) Not being a Mac user, the Metal work-around isn't an alternative for me, I suppose.. System specs: Windows 10 Version 21H2 Graphics: AMD Radeon RX6700 XT CPU: AMD Ryzen 7 3700X 8-Core

Removed subscriber: @dbarch

I am a little lost. How do we implement the work-around (use Metal backend)? :-(

@Matt_HH nobody mentioned before it was also a windows issue. Can you report you full system info? Although I have not been able to reproduce it on windows, so might be a local issue on your system. If others are able to reproduce in windows let us know!

@RunningWolf in Blender 3.5 under system preferences there is an option to use Metal in stead of OpenGL. After changing, restart Blender.

@Toba download alpha version of Blender 3.5. You’re looking at cycles settings :-) it should work from macOS version 10.15 and up.

@Matt_HH nobody mentioned before it was also a windows issue. Can you report you full system info? Although I have not been able to reproduce it on windows, so might be a local issue on your system. If others are able to reproduce in windows let us know! @RunningWolf in Blender 3.5 under system preferences there is an option to use Metal in stead of OpenGL. After changing, restart Blender. @Toba download alpha version of Blender 3.5. You’re looking at cycles settings :-) it should work from macOS version 10.15 and up.

Update: I did another test with Blender 3.4.1, as well as with Blender 3.5 Alpha.

It seems that the said problem only occurs with AMD drivers prior to version 22.11.2 (AMD software: Adrenalin Edition 22.11.2).
With the latest AMD drivers, everything works as expected again. (At least in my case.)

Update: I did another test with Blender 3.4.1, as well as with Blender 3.5 Alpha. It seems that the said problem only occurs with AMD drivers prior to version 22.11.2 (AMD software: Adrenalin Edition 22.11.2). With the latest AMD drivers, everything works as expected again. (At least in my case.)

I can confirm switching to Metal backend on MacBook Pro Monterey (see image for specs) the problem is FIXED in 3.5 alpha. Thanks!

I can confirm switching to Metal backend on MacBook Pro Monterey (see image for specs) the problem is FIXED in 3.5 alpha. Thanks! ![image.png](https://archive.blender.org/developer/F14149917/image.png)

I also want to report that switching to Metal backend fixed the drawing problem in Blender 3.5. :-)

However :-( when working in General 3d a selected mesh does not show outline select. Outline select seems to work fine with other objects.

I also want to report that switching to Metal backend fixed the drawing problem in Blender 3.5. :-) However :-( when working in General 3d a selected mesh does not show outline select. Outline select seems to work fine with other objects.

Thank Jeroen :-)
I confirm that Blender 3.5 Metal back end solves the issue but create another one which is crashing when selecting the default cube.
I made a report there : https://developer.blender.org/T104012

Thank Jeroen :-) I confirm that Blender 3.5 Metal back end solves the issue but create another one which is crashing when selecting the default cube. I made a report there : https://developer.blender.org/T104012

Thank you all for your patience. I will close this issue as I don’t expect any efforts will be planned to fix this for OpenGL. Being deprecated et al

Changed status from 'Confirmed' to: 'Resolved'

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Regression: Grease Pencil: Drawing lines appear after releasing the mouse #102251