After cancelling moving bones with X-Mirror, the mirror-bones have new location. #40991

New Issue

Mario Mey · 2014-07-08T14:41:47+02:00

Mario Mey commented

2014-07-08 14:41:47 +02:00

Open the file
Move the bones.
Cancel with Esc or Righ-click.

The bones in right, now, have the new location.

- Open the file - Move the bones. - Cancel with Esc or Righ-click. The bones in right, now, have the new location. [55-bones-x-mirror.blend](https://archive.blender.org/developer/F97085/55-bones-x-mirror.blend)

Mario Mey commented

2014-07-08 14:41:47 +02:00

Changed status to: 'Open'

Mario Mey commented

2014-07-08 14:41:47 +02:00

Added subscriber: @MarioSottile

Antonis Ryakiotakis commented

2014-07-09 15:34:36 +02:00

Added subscriber: @Psy-Fi

Antonis Ryakiotakis commented

2014-07-09 15:34:36 +02:00

I can see this on 2af99b7

I can see this on 2af99b7

Antonis Ryakiotakis self-assigned this 2014-07-09 15:34:49 +02:00

blender-admin commented

2014-07-09 18:58:56 +02:00

This issue was referenced by b617d6d5e6

This issue was referenced by b617d6d5e6604cb259740e486bf1ac6c07cf42d9

Antonis Ryakiotakis commented

2014-07-09 18:59:30 +02:00

Changed status from 'Open' to: 'Resolved'

Antonis Ryakiotakis closed this issue

2014-07-09 18:59:30 +02:00

Antonis Ryakiotakis commented

2014-07-09 18:59:30 +02:00

Closed by commit b617d6d5e6.

Closed by commit b617d6d5e6.

Daniel Salazar commented

2014-07-21 23:46:25 +02:00

Added subscriber: @zanqdo

Daniel Salazar commented

2014-07-21 23:46:25 +02:00

I prefer the old behavior better, used to rely on it to mirror selections of bones without the fear of introducing changes to the selected bones. IMO this is a regression

bassam kurdali commented

2014-07-21 23:49:30 +02:00

Added subscriber: @BassamKurdali

bassam kurdali commented

2014-07-21 23:49:30 +02:00

yeah same here, I used to depend on the old behavior; works similar if you do enter instead of esc but with esc you know you didn't change anything.

yeah same here, I used to depend on the old behavior; works similar if you do enter instead of esc but with esc you *know* you didn't change anything.

Juan Pablo Bouza commented

2014-07-21 23:52:35 +02:00

Added subscriber: @jpbouza-4

Juan Pablo Bouza commented

2014-07-21 23:52:35 +02:00

Yep, old behavior was better and I relied on it too. -1 for mariomey, I will take care of him when I see him in some conference....

Antonis Ryakiotakis commented

2014-07-22 09:48:31 +02:00

Transform, 0, enter does the same, while it was impossible to restore the positions with old behaviour. This sounds to me like a convenient bug rather than a feature.

Maybe make it an option? :p

http://xkcd.com/1172/

Transform, 0, enter does the same, while it was impossible to restore the positions with old behaviour. This sounds to me like a convenient bug rather than a feature. Maybe make it an option? :p http://xkcd.com/1172/

Mario Mey commented

2014-07-22 13:18:49 +02:00

Well, I reported this bug because its similarity to this one: https://developer.blender.org/T40548

I used to use this "convenient bug", too... but, some days ago, I moved some non-mirrored bones and this bug broke my armature. It doesn't matter that armature, I just think it is a bug...

Well, the new way to make the armature mirrored without change the selected bones is by pressing G and Return, quickly. It's just practice... :P

Well, I reported this bug because its similarity to this one: https://developer.blender.org/T40548 I used to use this "convenient bug", too... but, some days ago, I moved some non-mirrored bones and this bug broke my armature. It doesn't matter that armature, I just think it is a bug... Well, the new way to make the armature mirrored without change the selected bones is by pressing G and Return, quickly. It's just practice... :P

Daniel Salazar commented

2014-07-22 21:57:41 +02:00

@Psy-Fi Transform 0 does NOT work. Try it, move the bone a bit, hit 0, Enter.

I'm not sure it was a bug to begin with, Esc is not the same as Undo, it just cancels current operator. IMO The mirror effect should still be applied.

@Psy-Fi Transform 0 does NOT work. Try it, move the bone a bit, hit 0, Enter. I'm not sure it was a bug to begin with, Esc is not the same as Undo, it just cancels current operator. IMO The mirror effect should still be applied.

Sergey Sharybin commented

2014-07-22 22:19:59 +02:00

Changed status from 'Resolved' to: 'Open'

Sergey Sharybin reopened this issue

2014-07-22 22:19:59 +02:00

Sergey Sharybin commented

2014-07-22 22:19:59 +02:00

Added subscriber: @Sergey

Sergey Sharybin commented

2014-07-22 22:22:00 +02:00

@Psy-Fi, re-opening so it doesn't get lost. Mind having a closer look on what's zan and slick reports? Thanks!

bassam kurdali commented

2014-07-22 22:28:52 +02:00

TBH I'm on the fence here. I understand the abstract 'least surprise' argument for this bug. However, it was nice having such a quick simple way to mirror things. I don't think the 'destroyed my rig' argument is quite appropriate, since undo works?

destructive changes to Non-mirrored mirrored bones* with the X-mirror option on (does this make sense?)
however:

you might want to move the non mirrored mirrored bone on one side (here you undo and turn off xmirror), then redo if you want to.
undo here does work.

the case where you have an unmirrored, mirrored bone is pretty rare

however, G 0 Enter and ctrl R 0 Enter are only one extra keypress, so long as they work, and not that big a deal imo.

Non-mirrored mirrored bones = bones with .L and .R suffixes that are not supposed to be geometrically mirrored in the rig.

TBH I'm on the fence here. I understand the abstract 'least surprise' argument for this bug. However, it was nice having such a quick simple way to mirror things. I don't think the 'destroyed my rig' argument is quite appropriate, since undo works? destructive changes to Non-mirrored mirrored bones* with the X-mirror option on (does this make sense?) however: - you might want to move the non mirrored mirrored bone on one side (here you undo and turn off xmirror), then redo if you want to. - undo here does work. # the case where you have an unmirrored, mirrored bone is pretty rare however, G 0 Enter and ctrl R 0 Enter are only one extra keypress, so long as they work, and not that big a deal imo. * Non-mirrored mirrored bones = bones with .L and .R suffixes that are not supposed to be geometrically mirrored in the rig.

Antonis Ryakiotakis commented

2014-07-23 15:19:46 +02:00

Hi,

Undo did not work on the original, the positions would be lost forever (try on 2.71). Transform 0 does not work indeed, you need to either grab, x, 0 or rotate 0 to make it work.

However given that you couldn't get the original back and that it's just an extra quite intuitive keypress (given blender workflow) to have a mirrored armature, I'd vote for keeping the fix.

Hi, Undo did not work on the original, the positions would be lost forever (try on 2.71). Transform 0 does not work indeed, you need to either grab, x, 0 or rotate 0 to make it work. However given that you couldn't get the original back and that it's just an extra quite intuitive keypress (given blender workflow) to have a mirrored armature, I'd vote for keeping the fix.

bassam kurdali commented

2014-07-23 15:43:01 +02:00

hmm, then I think it is acceptable to keep the fix, use R 0 Enter / ctrl R 0 enter to do the mirroring (one extra key press) and continue;
ZanQdo, JPBouza, Mariomey, what do you think?
PS since this affects usability it should also be documented as a change in release notes, not just a bug fix.

hmm, then I think it is acceptable to keep the fix, use R 0 Enter / ctrl R 0 enter to do the mirroring (one extra key press) and continue; ZanQdo, JPBouza, Mariomey, what do you think? PS since this affects usability it should also be documented as a change in release notes, not just a bug fix.

Mario Mey commented

2014-07-23 21:38:37 +02:00

IMO I don't think that leaving this bug (*) would be good to Blender development. As I wrote before, it is similar to the other bug. What makes you think that this bug didn't "make" the other bug, using as reference the bugged code to make the new one?

G - X - 0 - Enter / R - X - 0 - Enter / Ctrl-G - X - 0 - Enter ... for mirror armature without modification.

It was my mistake to try to move non-mirrored mirrored bones with X-mirror on... and Undo did work in old behaviour... however, I think the most important thing is what I said in first line of this comment (about Blender development).

I repeat, this is my opinion. I'm not a programmer and I don't know how the people create-develop-fix code for Blender (for me, they are ET).

(*): even if someone likes this "feature", for me, it is a bug. Esc and Right-click are cancel for almost everything in Blender.

IMO I don't think that leaving this bug (*) would be good to Blender development. As I wrote before, it is similar to the other bug. What makes you think that this bug didn't "make" the other bug, using as reference the bugged code to make the new one? G - X - 0 - Enter / R - X - 0 - Enter / Ctrl-G - X - 0 - Enter ... for mirror armature without modification. It was my mistake to try to move non-mirrored mirrored bones with X-mirror on... and Undo did work in old behaviour... however, I think the most important thing is what I said in first line of this comment (about Blender development). I repeat, this is my opinion. I'm not a programmer and I don't know how the people create-develop-fix code for Blender (for me, they are ET). (*): even if someone likes this "feature", for me, it is a bug. Esc and Right-click are cancel for almost everything in Blender.

bassam kurdali commented

2014-07-23 22:43:39 +02:00

Yeah, you guys have convinced me. Sorry Zan, JPBouza, I think we should keep the fix!!