Regression: Header transform options hide on modal operation #93594

New Issue

jackie · 2021-12-03T08:02:11+01:00

jackie commented

2021-12-03 08:02:11 +01:00

System Information
Operating system: Windows-10-10.0.17763-SP0 64 Bits
Graphics card: NVIDIA GeForce RTX 2060/PCIe/SSE2 NVIDIA Corporation 4.5.0 NVIDIA 496.76

Blender Version
Broken: version: 3.0.0, branch: master, commit date: 2021-12-02 18:35, f1cca30557
Worked: version: 2.93.6, c842a90e2f

Short description of error
Following the reorganization of the Header and Tool Settings panes under #91536, the header's transform options (Pivot, snapping, proportional settings) will hide along with the rest of the header panel content when performing any modal operation such as move, rotate, or scale. Previously these icons stayed visible and were handy for confirming which pivot, snapping, and proportional settings were in use mid-operation.

In 2.93, these icons were part of Tool Settings that stayed visible, while modal operations would hide navigation gizmos in the 3D viewport instead.
In 3.0.0, the header and all icons will hide in order to display the operation's transform data at the top left of the header, while the gizmos stay visible as intended (fixed in 917a972b56).

It would be useful for these header option icons to stay visible as the gizmos do, especially during the transforms themselves. I noticed that SHOW_MODAL_ALL was introduced in fb27a9bb98 to address the gizmos, but i'm unsure if the header and transform options are configured to use this flag.

Exact steps for others to reproduce the error
Load any new or existing .blend into 3.0.0 and transform any object while observing the header.
Video example with 2.93.6 and 3.0.0, note the header and 3D viewport gizmos alternatively:
2021-12-03_00-36-27c.mp4

**System Information** Operating system: Windows-10-10.0.17763-SP0 64 Bits Graphics card: NVIDIA GeForce RTX 2060/PCIe/SSE2 NVIDIA Corporation 4.5.0 NVIDIA 496.76 **Blender Version** Broken: version: 3.0.0, branch: master, commit date: 2021-12-02 18:35, f1cca30557 Worked: version: 2.93.6, c842a90e2fa1 **Short description of error** Following the reorganization of the Header and Tool Settings panes under #91536, the header's transform options (Pivot, snapping, proportional settings) will hide along with the rest of the header panel content when performing any modal operation such as move, rotate, or scale. Previously these icons stayed visible and were handy for confirming which pivot, snapping, and proportional settings were in use mid-operation. In 2.93, these icons were part of Tool Settings that stayed visible, while modal operations would hide navigation gizmos in the 3D viewport instead. In 3.0.0, the header and all icons will hide in order to display the operation's transform data at the top left of the header, while the gizmos stay visible as intended (fixed in 917a972b56). It would be useful for these header option icons to stay visible as the gizmos do, especially during the transforms themselves. I noticed that `SHOW_MODAL_ALL` was introduced in fb27a9bb98 to address the gizmos, but i'm unsure if the header and transform options are configured to use this flag. **Exact steps for others to reproduce the error** Load any new or existing .blend into 3.0.0 and transform any object while observing the header. Video example with 2.93.6 and 3.0.0, note the header and 3D viewport gizmos alternatively: [2021-12-03_00-36-27c.mp4](https://archive.blender.org/developer/F12683379/2021-12-03_00-36-27c.mp4)

jackie commented

2021-12-03 08:02:11 +01:00

Added subscriber: @jackiejake

Germano Cavalcante commented

2021-12-06 18:29:15 +01:00

Added subscribers: @ideasman42, @mano-wii

Germano Cavalcante commented

2021-12-06 18:29:15 +01:00

Changed status from 'Needs Triage' to: 'Needs Developer To Reproduce'

Germano Cavalcante commented

2021-12-06 18:29:15 +01:00

This is a side effect of the design discussed in #91536 (Swap Tool Settings and Headers in Editors).
I'm not sure the behavior during modal operations was predicted.
Needs more feedback from developers and artists.

This is a side effect of the design discussed in #91536 (Swap Tool Settings and Headers in Editors). I'm not sure the behavior during modal operations was predicted. Needs more feedback from developers and artists.

slwk1d commented

2022-02-11 12:06:02 +01:00

Added subscriber: @Slowwkidd

slwk1d commented

2022-02-11 12:06:02 +01:00

This is one of the consequences of the Header Swap that bugs the most, hope the devs take a look at this since it really downgrades usability.

Alberto Velázquez commented

2022-02-23 11:59:12 +01:00

Added subscriber: @AlbertoVelazquez

Alberto Velázquez commented

2022-02-23 11:59:12 +01:00

In #93594#1266452, @mano-wii wrote:
Needs more feedback from developers and artists.

Here you have

https://devtalk.blender.org/t/the-problems-of-coherence-and-use-that-has-generated-the-change-of-tool-shelf/22346/

> In #93594#1266452, @mano-wii wrote: > Needs more feedback from developers and artists. Here you have https://devtalk.blender.org/t/the-problems-of-coherence-and-use-that-has-generated-the-change-of-tool-shelf/22346/

slwk1d commented

2022-02-23 12:10:12 +01:00

I really hope the devs pay attention to this and reconsider this change, which wasn't a small one and in my opinion causes more problems rather than solving them, honestly for an unneeded consistency with the other headers. As I already mentioned on Blender.chat with no response whatsoever, now there are way more chances where the header becomes crowded, cutting important menus like Shading and Overlays.

Under the task https:*developer.blender.org/T91536 many users gave feedback about the problems that this change caused, also the author of the original tool shelf Alberto Velàzquez gave his feedback both there, on blender.chat and on devtalk , but there was always little response from the devs about this. Even the developer Harley Achenson commented on the task implying that there was very little discussion about this in the UI team. Please at least consider having an option in the header menu to swap it back to the original layout.

I really hope the devs pay attention to this and reconsider this change, which wasn't a small one and in my opinion causes more problems rather than solving them, honestly for an unneeded consistency with the other headers. As I already mentioned on Blender.chat with no response whatsoever, now there are way more chances where the header becomes crowded, cutting important menus like Shading and Overlays. ![Screenshot_1.png](https://archive.blender.org/developer/F12884046/Screenshot_1.png) Under the task https:*developer.blender.org/T91536 many users gave feedback about the problems that this change caused, also the author of the original tool shelf Alberto Velàzquez gave his feedback both there, on blender.chat and on [devtalk ](https:*devtalk.blender.org/t/the-problems-of-coherence-and-use-that-has-generated-the-change-of-tool-shelf/22346), but there was always little response from the devs about this. Even the developer Harley Achenson commented on the task implying that there was very little discussion about this in the UI team. Please at least consider having an option in the header menu to swap it back to the original layout.

jackie commented

2022-02-23 22:12:56 +01:00

Unfortunately this regression has kept me on 2.93 LTS for the time being, as it is that detrimental to my workflow. Any time an in-progress transform behaves unexpectedly (spoiler alert, often), I reflex-glance at the header to get an instant confirmation of which pivot point it was left on, or if I left snapping enabled, without having to cancel the transform first.

This data should simply be visible at all times, regardless of the header/toolshelf placement.

The 3D viewport gizmos stay visible now during transforms in 3.0, and that was certainly an improvement, unrelated to the header swap. I think the best solution to this problem would be to have that same behavior on the transform options.

Unfortunately this regression has kept me on 2.93 LTS for the time being, as it is *that* detrimental to my workflow. Any time an in-progress transform behaves unexpectedly (spoiler alert, often), I reflex-glance at the header to get an instant confirmation of which pivot point it was left on, or if I left snapping enabled, without having to cancel the transform first. This data should simply be visible at all times, regardless of the header/toolshelf placement. The 3D viewport gizmos stay visible now during transforms in 3.0, and that was certainly an improvement, unrelated to the header swap. I think the best solution to this problem would be to have that same behavior on the transform options.

Pauan commented

2022-02-24 15:12:56 +01:00

Added subscriber: @pauanyu_blender

jackie commented

2022-09-08 23:31:37 +02:00

With the 3.3 LTS release, i've revisited and found this regression is still in place.

This has a simple solution, the transform data (Dx, Dy, Dz) should not blank the rest of the header mid-transform. No indicators or controls should be hidden during a transform in the first place, header or anywhere. The toolbar/header shakeup has uncovered this behavior now that the transform data line has moved into the header bar.

I even daresay that transform data would be much better placed underneath the 3D viewport information overlay (Text Info). This is more visually concise than either previous implementation, as transformations in progress are going to be against the active object already indicated in that area.

For instance:

User Perspective
(1) Scene Collection | Cube
Dx: 1 m  Dy: 2 m  Dz: 0 m (2.236m)

Or even indicating with brackets that a transform is in progress:

Camera Perspective
(1) named_Collection | named_Object
[ Rotation: -106 ]

I've built Blender to include a mockup, now to try and make it functional:

With the 3.3 LTS release, i've revisited and found this regression is still in place. This has a simple solution, the transform data (Dx, Dy, Dz) should not blank the rest of the header mid-transform. **No** indicators or controls should be hidden during a transform in the first place, header or anywhere. The toolbar/header shakeup has uncovered this behavior now that the transform data line has moved into the header bar. I even daresay that transform data would be much better placed underneath the 3D viewport information overlay (Text Info). This is more visually concise than either previous implementation, as transformations in progress are going to be against the active object already indicated in that area. For instance: ``` User Perspective (1) Scene Collection | Cube Dx: 1 m Dy: 2 m Dz: 0 m (2.236m) ``` Or even indicating with brackets that a transform is in progress: ``` Camera Perspective (1) named_Collection | named_Object [ Rotation: -106 ] ``` I've built Blender to include a mockup, now to try and make it functional: ![image.png](https://archive.blender.org/developer/F13471064/image.png)

Pratik Borhade commented

2022-12-07 11:12:44 +01:00

Added subscriber: @PratikPB2123

Pratik Borhade commented

2022-12-07 11:12:44 +01:00

@ideasman42 hi, any updates on this? Will there be any changes to improve this? Otherwise we can close this ticket.

jackie changed title from ~~Header transform options hide on modal operation~~ to Regression: Header transform options hide on modal operation

2022-12-07 19:33:03 +01:00

jackie commented

2022-12-07 19:39:42 +01:00

This regression seems to have gone under the radar, I don't understand why it hasn't rustled more people up. New users to 3.x obviously won't know what's wrong, but how do long-time users of 2.x not notice indicators and buttons disappearing on every transform?
To quote a year-old thread: https://devtalk.blender.org/t/the-problems-of-coherence-and-use-that-has-generated-the-change-of-tool-shelf/22346/2

Sometimes it surprises me that so few of us see it as a problem when the damn interface disappears while you are modeling.

Earlier this year I set up a build env to try and move this transform data to a sensible location so it does not blank out the header bar, but have only had a few chances to try much. Last attempt, I was only able to determine the variable/structure that stores the transform data, wasn't able to display it in another area. I need dedicated time to familiarize myself with Blender's structure and C++ in general to move further.

I realize the title was not reflecting this issue's nature, this is a regression to the previous working behavior of the header/transform options.

This regression seems to have gone under the radar, I don't understand why it hasn't rustled more people up. New users to 3.x obviously won't know what's wrong, but how do long-time users of 2.x not notice indicators and buttons disappearing on every transform? To quote a year-old thread: https://devtalk.blender.org/t/the-problems-of-coherence-and-use-that-has-generated-the-change-of-tool-shelf/22346/2 > Sometimes it surprises me that so few of us see it as a problem when the damn interface disappears while you are modeling. Earlier this year I set up a build env to try and move this transform data to a sensible location so it does not blank out the header bar, but have only had a few chances to try much. Last attempt, I was only able to determine the variable/structure that stores the transform data, wasn't able to display it in another area. I need dedicated time to familiarize myself with Blender's structure and C++ in general to move further. ![image.png](https://archive.blender.org/developer/F14018664/image.png) I realize the title was not reflecting this issue's nature, this is a regression to the previous working behavior of the header/transform options.

Russell commented

2022-12-31 20:09:32 +01:00

Added subscriber: @Russ1642

Philipp Oeser removed the

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Regression: Header transform options hide on modal operation #93594