Design: New Graph Editor Key Manipulation Operators #81836

New Issue

Christoph Lendenfeld · 2020-10-19T12:15:10+02:00

2020-10-19 12:15:10 +02:00

This is the design task for #81785

Builds
Linux: https://blender.community/c/graphicall/6qbbbc/
Windows: https://blender.community/c/graphicall/7qbbbc/

Big picture:
Blender already has the pose sliding tools, that allow you to interactively create breakdowns in Pose mode.
It uses a modal operator and the cursor to interactively set the pose. Using the same interaction, we could add similar functionality to the graph editor to manipulate multiple keyframes.

Here is how it works:
graph_editor_slider_tools.mp4

UI

Operators will be in a submenu in within "Key"

For quicker access they are in a pie menu
However this poses the question of how this would work when more operators get added.
What hotkey should be used? I've temporarily set it as ALT + SHIFT + S

Use the new slider representation from D9054
This makes it possible to quickly reach 0% or 100% because it's capped.
Overshoot can be enabled at the press of a button

This is the design task for #81785 --- **Builds** Linux: https://blender.community/c/graphicall/6qbbbc/ Windows: https://blender.community/c/graphicall/7qbbbc/ --- **Big picture:** Blender already has the pose sliding tools, that allow you to interactively create breakdowns in Pose mode. It uses a modal operator and the cursor to interactively set the pose. Using the same interaction, we could add similar functionality to the graph editor to manipulate multiple keyframes. Here is how it works: [graph_editor_slider_tools.mp4](https://archive.blender.org/developer/F9219671/graph_editor_slider_tools.mp4) --- ### UI **Operators will be in a submenu in within "Key"** ![graph_editor_slider_menu_2.png](https://archive.blender.org/developer/F9052081/graph_editor_slider_menu_2.png) **For quicker access they are in a pie menu** However this poses the question of how this would work when more operators get added. What hotkey should be used? I've temporarily set it as `ALT + SHIFT + S` ![slider_pie_menu.png](https://archive.blender.org/developer/F9052077/slider_pie_menu.png) **Use the new slider representation from [D9054](https://archive.blender.org/developer/D9054)** This makes it possible to quickly reach 0% or 100% because it's capped. Overshoot can be enabled at the press of a button ![slider_gui_2021_04_28.png](https://archive.blender.org/developer/F10113211/slider_gui_2021_04_28.png)

Christoph Lendenfeld self-assigned this 2020-10-19 12:15:10 +02:00

Christoph Lendenfeld commented

2020-10-19 12:15:10 +02:00

Changed status from 'Needs Triage' to: 'Confirmed'

Christoph Lendenfeld commented

2020-10-19 12:15:10 +02:00

Added subscriber: @ChrisLend

Sybren A. Stüvel commented

2020-10-20 12:11:10 +02:00

Added subscriber: @dr.sybren

Sybren A. Stüvel commented

2020-10-20 12:11:10 +02:00

Using the same interaction, we could add similar functionality to the graph editor to manipulate multiple keyframes.
Here is a rough mockup of how this would work.

Functionality-wise, the video looks nice, indeed.

For quicker access they should be in a pie menu

Can you make a screenshot of what such a pie menu would look like? You can modify any pie menu (for example GRAPH_MT_key_snap in space_graph.py) so that it just has the appropriate labels. That's enough for a screenshot.

However this poses the question of how this would work when more operators get added.

I think that operators should be added based on their function, and not on whether or not they use this manipulation method. That may open up a different categorisation, with a pie menu for every category.

Maybe you can update this task's description so that it's clearer how it relates to its child tasks. Now this task and #81785 (Implementation: Modal Key Manipulation Operators) have almost identical titles.

> Using the same interaction, we could add similar functionality to the graph editor to manipulate multiple keyframes. > Here is a rough mockup of how this would work. Functionality-wise, the video looks nice, indeed. > For quicker access they should be in a pie menu Can you make a screenshot of what such a pie menu would look like? You can modify any pie menu (for example `GRAPH_MT_key_snap` in `space_graph.py`) so that it just has the appropriate labels. That's enough for a screenshot. > However this poses the question of how this would work when more operators get added. I think that operators should be added based on their function, and not on whether or not they use this manipulation method. That may open up a different categorisation, with a pie menu for every category. Maybe you can update this task's description so that it's clearer how it relates to its child tasks. Now this task and #81785 (Implementation: Modal Key Manipulation Operators) have almost identical titles.

Luciano Muñoz Sessarego commented

2020-10-29 17:00:51 +01:00

Added subscriber: @LucianoMunoz

Luciano Muñoz Sessarego commented

2020-10-29 17:00:51 +01:00

Would love it if anyone could build a Windows version .... wink wink

Alex Bing commented

2020-11-03 17:18:26 +01:00

Added subscriber: @HazyHops

Alex Bing commented

2020-11-03 17:18:26 +01:00

DUDE this is AMAZING. Most of these work exactly how I initial figured! Thanks for getting that Windows version up! :D

(Having never posted on a design task, let me know if formatting and such is wrong and I can adjust accordingly)

You may or may not know some of these already?

Seemingly any non-flat bezier tangents have issues when modified by any slider. Specifically the left-side handles stay still.
Smooth Slider: Not sure how the specifics are working but it but on the Smooth slider, going over 100% overshoots the value change of any individual key. Would love to hear other's thoughts on it, but since negative values "un-smooth", I would expect a positive overshoot on Smooth to have the same effect as running multiple 100% smooth actions instead overshooting? (lemme know if you need a vid/image lol)
Sensitivity: Slider representation will fix current value adjusting so I look forward to that, but allowing SHIFT for micro adjustments, (and CTRL/something for larger (significant overshoot) adjustments) would make the slider even more powerful.

**DUDE** this is *AMAZING*. Most of these work exactly how I initial figured! Thanks for getting that Windows version up! :D (Having never posted on a design task, let me know if formatting and such is wrong and I can adjust accordingly) You may or may not know some of these already? - Seemingly any non-flat bezier tangents have issues when modified by any slider. Specifically the left-side handles stay still. - Smooth Slider: Not sure how the specifics are working but it but on the Smooth slider, going over 100% overshoots the value change of any individual key. Would love to hear other's thoughts on it, but since negative values "un-smooth", I would expect a positive overshoot on Smooth to have the same effect as running multiple 100% smooth actions instead overshooting? (lemme know if you need a vid/image lol) - Sensitivity: Slider representation will fix current value adjusting so I look forward to that, but allowing SHIFT for micro adjustments, (and CTRL/something for larger (significant overshoot) adjustments) would make the slider even more powerful.

Christoph Lendenfeld commented

2020-11-03 17:41:09 +01:00

thanks for the feedback
formatting is good ;)

I'll look into the tangent handles issue. I haven't noticed that until now, but it should be reasonably easy to fix. Thanks for pointing that out.
Smooth is less than ideal, I agree. In fact the algorithm doesn't work properly if keys are not evenly spaced. So this needs to be redone, but I'd say this is out of the scope of this task. Especially since I need to decide on an algorithm first (or a choice of algorithms?)
Yes the slider will be implemented in the end. SHIFT and CTRL will work as in D9054. I'll let you know when that's in for testing

thanks for the feedback formatting is good ;) * I'll look into the tangent handles issue. I haven't noticed that until now, but it should be reasonably easy to fix. Thanks for pointing that out. * Smooth is less than ideal, I agree. In fact the algorithm doesn't work properly if keys are not evenly spaced. So this needs to be redone, but I'd say this is out of the scope of this task. Especially since I need to decide on an algorithm first (or a choice of algorithms?) * Yes the slider will be implemented in the end. SHIFT and CTRL will work as in [D9054](https://archive.blender.org/developer/D9054). I'll let you know when that's in for testing

acorn anim commented

2020-11-06 21:53:27 +01:00

Added subscriber: @acorn

acorn anim commented

2020-11-06 21:53:27 +01:00

Mac version would be very useful.

Erick Tukuniata commented

2020-11-17 08:42:08 +01:00

Added subscriber: @ErickNyanduKabongo

Jan-Willem van Dronkelaar commented

2020-11-19 17:24:27 +01:00

Added subscriber: @jwvdronkelaar

Fin O'Riordan commented

2020-11-22 23:35:29 +01:00

Added subscriber: @FinbarrORiordan

Jay Edwards commented

2021-05-04 00:31:12 +02:00

Added subscriber: @Jaye.Antoni_Whyldz

Jay Edwards commented

2021-05-04 00:31:12 +02:00

this needs to be here v2.90

blender-admin commented

2021-05-14 10:46:19 +02:00

This issue was referenced by 9797b95f61

This issue was referenced by 9797b95f617561dc87b702e1bce829a551260689

Jason schleifer commented

2021-06-24 18:31:21 +02:00

Added subscriber: @JasonSchleifer

Jason schleifer commented

2021-06-24 18:31:21 +02:00

Super cool! In terms of hotkeys, since animators are already used to Shift+E to go to pose mode while in the 3D viewport, would it be possible to use something similar like ctrl+shift+e or something like that? Then it'll feel like an extension of the tool they're used to, just with more awesome power. :)

Luciano Muñoz Sessarego commented

2021-06-24 18:43:13 +02:00

I agree wish Jason here, i feel maybe the main one or the last one you use from the piemenu can be put in shift e, and shift alt e or shift control ee could be used to get the pie menu with all the options

Christoph Lendenfeld commented

2021-06-26 23:13:50 +02:00

Shift+E would be ideal to keep it consistent, but that hotkey is currently used by "Set Keyframe Extrapolation"

To be fair I think that's not used heavily but we should discuss it at the next meeting.
Either move the pose sliding tools to something else than Shift+E that is available in the graph editor
Or move the "Set Keyframe Extrapolation" thingy to something else

As long as it's consistent I don't mind

3.0 might be a good version to swap things around anyway

Shift+E would be ideal to keep it consistent, but that hotkey is currently used by "Set Keyframe Extrapolation" To be fair I think that's not used heavily but we should discuss it at the next meeting. Either move the pose sliding tools to something else than Shift+E that is available in the graph editor Or move the "Set Keyframe Extrapolation" thingy to something else As long as it's consistent I don't mind 3.0 might be a good version to swap things around anyway

Luciano Muñoz Sessarego commented

2021-06-27 00:52:16 +02:00

I've been inclined to try to think how to do a better version of that menu (set keyframe extrapolation) to be able to use it to add any sort of curve modifier to all the curves selected.
I'd agree that we could move it away from shift e for consitency and come up with a new solution for that.

I've been inclined to try to think how to do a better version of that menu (set keyframe extrapolation) to be able to use it to add any sort of curve modifier to all the curves selected. I'd agree that we could move it away from shift e for consitency and come up with a new solution for that.

Christiaan Moleman commented

2021-10-05 11:48:57 +02:00

Added subscriber: @ChristiaanMoleman

Andy Cuccaro commented

2021-10-14 19:15:22 +02:00

Added subscriber: @AndyCuccaro

Loïc DAUTRY commented

2021-10-29 21:52:03 +02:00

Added subscriber: @L0Lock

Robert Windefjord commented

2021-11-23 21:53:15 +01:00

Added subscriber: @Robonnet

Kevin C. Burke commented

2021-12-07 18:27:40 +01:00

Added subscriber: @KevinCBurke

Kevin C. Burke commented

2021-12-07 19:42:14 +01:00

This comment was removed by @KevinCBurke

*This comment was removed by @KevinCBurke*

Kevin C. Burke commented

2021-12-07 19:49:27 +01:00

I was using it incorrectly at first, but after switching to Blend to Neighbor, I got the right behavior. This feature in incredible, @ChrisLend !!

I was using it incorrectly at first, but after switching to Blend to Neighbor, I got the right behavior. This feature in **incredible**, @ChrisLend !!

Ghost commented

2021-12-14 04:33:10 +01:00

Added subscriber: @hahnzhu

Ethan Simon commented

2021-12-25 05:24:24 +01:00

Added subscriber: @razed

Ethan Simon commented

2021-12-25 05:24:24 +01:00

Can something like sample undershoot? Might be nice for quick cleanup :)

Christoph Lendenfeld commented

2021-12-25 20:37:35 +01:00

In #81836#1278241, @razed wrote:
Can something like sample undershoot? Might be nice for quick cleanup :)

Could you explain what you mean? Maybe even an example for how it would be used

> In #81836#1278241, @razed wrote: > Can something like sample undershoot? Might be nice for quick cleanup :) Could you explain what you mean? Maybe even an example for how it would be used

Ethan Simon commented

2022-01-06 00:03:32 +01:00

Sorry for taking so long to get back to you, I was thinking something like the decimate feature but it would try to keep the original bezier shape as best it possibly could. If this comes off as feature request-y, I apologize and ignore me :). I was thinking it could be an extension of the sample operator (to undershoot) but It might just be unrelated functionality.

Steffen Dünner commented

2022-04-14 12:32:58 +02:00

Added subscriber: @SteffenD

Christoph Lendenfeld was unassigned by Sybren A. Stüvel

2022-05-09 11:37:24 +02:00

Sybren A. Stüvel commented

2022-05-09 11:37:24 +02:00

@ChrisLend is stepping down from this work, as other things in his life take priority. As such, I'll take it off the "Short Term Tasks" list for now.

Philipp Oeser removed the

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Design: New Graph Editor Key Manipulation Operators #81836

UI