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Missing Face Set Operators #92944

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opened 2021-11-08 21:42:01 +01:00 by Joseph Eagar · 15 comments
Joseph Eagar commented 2021-11-08 21:42:01 +01:00
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This task is a todo list for missing face set operators. - [x] means operator works on either a user-picked face set or all of them. A single arrow means conversion operator in one direction already exist (so, Mask to Face Set already exists).

  • Face Set- [x] <-> Vertex Groups
  • Face Set- [x] <-> Face Maps
  • Face Set- [x] -> UV Seams
  • Face Set- [x] -> Mask
  • Make Disconnected Face Sets Unique
  • Separate By Face Sets
  • Face Set- [x] <-> Material Slots
  • Face Maps <-> Face Sets
This task is a todo list for missing face set operators. - [x] means operator works on either a user-picked face set or all of them. A single arrow means conversion operator in one direction already exist (so, Mask to Face Set already exists). - Face Set- [x] `<->` Vertex Groups - Face Set- [x] `<->` Face Maps - Face Set- [x] `->` UV Seams - Face Set- [x] `->` Mask - Make Disconnected Face Sets Unique - Separate By Face Sets - Face Set- [x] `<->` Material Slots - Face Maps `<->` Face Sets
Joseph Eagar self-assigned this 2021-11-08 21:42:01 +01:00
Joseph Eagar commented 2021-11-08 21:42:01 +01:00
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Changed status from 'Needs Triage' to: 'Confirmed'

Changed status from 'Needs Triage' to: 'Confirmed'
Joseph Eagar commented 2021-11-08 21:42:01 +01:00
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Added subscriber: @JosephEagar

Added subscriber: @JosephEagar
Tonatiuh de San Julián commented 2021-11-09 08:51:08 +01:00
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Tonatiuh de San Julián commented 2021-11-09 08:51:08 +01:00
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Vertex colors to face sets: so we can use colors of the existing color paint to mask in a very advance way.

Face sets from different density topology areas. And the a way to populate with a especific topological density a face set.

Vertex colors to face sets: so we can use colors of the existing color paint to mask in a very advance way. Face sets from different density topology areas. And the a way to populate with a especific topological density a face set.
Demeter Dzadik commented 2021-11-09 14:24:18 +01:00
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Added subscriber: @Mets

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Demeter Dzadik commented 2021-11-09 14:24:18 +01:00
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I think before spending a lot more dev time on face sets maps, it would be nice to have a design as to their purpose. As far as I understand their current implementation, they can only be used by addons, and those addons could very well just interpret vertex groups as face sets maps by inspecting the topology. The difference between face maps and face sets is even more esoteric.

Also, I think (hope) all of these things will be refactored during the Attribute Edit phase of the Geometry Nodes project, but I could be wrong. But definitely something to double check before you burn a lot of time into this.

I think before spending a lot more dev time on face ~~sets~~ maps, it would be nice to have a design as to their purpose. As far as I understand their current implementation, they can only be used by addons, and those addons could very well just interpret vertex groups as face ~~sets~~ maps by inspecting the topology. The difference between face maps and face sets is even more esoteric. Also, I think (hope) all of these things will be refactored during the Attribute Edit phase of the Geometry Nodes project, but I could be wrong. But definitely something to double check before you burn a lot of time into this.
Tonatiuh de San Julián commented 2021-11-09 14:27:43 +01:00
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In #92944#1251021, @Mets wrote:
I think before spending a lot more dev time on face sets, it would be nice to have a design as to their purpose. As far as I understand their current implementation, they can only be used by addons, and those addons could very well just interpret vertex groups as face sets by inspecting the topology. The different between face maps and face sets is even more esoteric.

Face sets are highly used in sculpt mode, it is an essential tool, every 3d sculptor can say that to you. That is why Joseph want them to be as a complete tool as it can be.

> In #92944#1251021, @Mets wrote: > I think before spending a lot more dev time on face sets, it would be nice to have a design as to their purpose. As far as I understand their current implementation, they can only be used by addons, and those addons could very well just interpret vertex groups as face sets by inspecting the topology. The different between face maps and face sets is even more esoteric. Face sets are highly used in sculpt mode, it is an essential tool, every 3d sculptor can say that to you. That is why Joseph want them to be as a complete tool as it can be.
Demeter Dzadik commented 2021-11-09 14:38:27 +01:00
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Sorry, I meant face maps, whose existence is so confusing that I still can't get it right.
So my comment only pertains to

2 Face Set- [x] <-> Face Maps
8 Face Maps <-> Face Sets

Sorry, I meant face maps, whose existence is so confusing that I still can't get it right. So my comment only pertains to > 2 Face Set- [x] <-> Face Maps > 8 Face Maps <-> Face Sets
Daniel Grauer commented 2022-03-31 23:36:40 +02:00
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Julien Kaspar commented 2023-07-04 09:58:44 +02:00
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@JosephEagar
Not sure if this can be closed. Most of these can be achieved with exisiting operators or geometry nodes.
Some are not even needed since the Face Sets attribute can now be directly accessed.

@JosephEagar Not sure if this can be closed. Most of these can be achieved with exisiting operators or geometry nodes. Some are not even needed since the Face Sets attribute can now be directly accessed.
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Joseph Eagar commented 2023-07-10 15:06:28 +02:00
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I saw some users trying to implement some of these with combinations of geometry nodes and scripts on BlenderArtists. It's way too much work.

I saw some users trying to implement some of these with combinations of geometry nodes and scripts on BlenderArtists. It's way too much work.
Julien Kaspar commented 2023-07-10 16:03:11 +02:00
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Just to be clear though. From that list many wouldn't be needed.

  • The primary use case of Vertex Group conversion is to use them for modifiers. In that case, Geometry Nodes offers more options, including using the Face Sets directly, right?
  • Face Maps are essentially depricated and are a generic attribute now. So that's geometry nodes territory.
  • UV Seams and UV maps should be handled by #109773
  • Face Sets can already be filled with a Mask with Expand. No extra operator needed there.
  • "Make Disconnected Face Sets Unique" is already implemented with "Initialize by Face Set Boundaries"
  • I don't know of the use case of converting Face Sets to Material Slots. Would be good to get some info there.
Just to be clear though. From that list many wouldn't be needed. - The primary use case of **Vertex Group** conversion is to use them for modifiers. In that case, Geometry Nodes offers more options, including using the Face Sets directly, right? - **Face Maps** are essentially depricated and are a generic attribute now. So that's geometry nodes territory. - **UV Seams** and **UV maps** should be handled by #109773 - Face Sets can already be filled with a **Mask** with Expand. No extra operator needed there. - "**Make Disconnected Face Sets Unique**" is already implemented with "Initialize by Face Set Boundaries" - I don't know of the use case of converting Face Sets to Material Slots. Would be good to get some info there.
Hans Goudey commented 2023-07-10 18:24:14 +02:00
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Geometry Nodes offers more options, including using the Face Sets directly, right?

Geometry nodes can't use the .sculpt_face_set attribute directly (except the future node group operators, not the modifier). So we should have an operator to copy face set values to an face domain integer attribute (that could also be a node group operator, depending on the timeline).

>Geometry Nodes offers more options, including using the Face Sets directly, right? Geometry nodes can't use the `.sculpt_face_set` attribute directly (except the future node group operators, not the modifier). So we should have an operator to copy face set values to an face domain integer attribute (that could also be a node group operator, depending on the timeline).
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Julien Kaspar commented 2023-07-11 10:22:01 +02:00
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What could be really useful then is to have operators to

  • save masks and face sets as named attributes
  • create masks and face sets from named attributes

This back and forth conversion can offer options for quick use with geometry nodes as well as the ability to store mask and face sets for later use.
For example, the use of "initialize face sets by uv seams" is done because it's a convenient way to store face sets atm. If face sets could just be saved directly, that could be a better way.

The use cases for converting face sets to material slot and vertex groups are not clear to me atm.

What could be really useful then is to have operators to - save masks and face sets as named attributes - create masks and face sets from named attributes This back and forth conversion can offer options for quick use with geometry nodes as well as the ability to store mask and face sets for later use. For example, the use of "initialize face sets by uv seams" is done because it's a convenient way to store face sets atm. If face sets could just be saved directly, that could be a better way. The use cases for converting face sets to material slot and vertex groups are not clear to me atm.
Joseph Eagar commented 2023-07-11 14:40:56 +02:00
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The purpose of converting to material slots is to interface with remesher addons, I imagine addon authors will eventually update them to read face set data directly.

One thing we could do is just make face sets a normal attribute. Almost all of the .sculpt_XXX attributes are temporary ones. We could make all non-temporary sculpt attributes public, so .sculpt_face_set could become paint_face_set or something (remember we want to eventually support face sets in all paint modes). We could do something similar for the persistent base attributes (e.g. .sculpt_persistent_co could be sculpt_persistent_co or something). I dunno.

The purpose of converting to material slots is to interface with remesher addons, I imagine addon authors will eventually update them to read face set data directly. One thing we could do is just make face sets a normal attribute. Almost all of the `.sculpt_XXX` attributes are temporary ones. We could make all non-temporary sculpt attributes public, so `.sculpt_face_set` could become `paint_face_set` or something (remember we want to eventually support face sets in all paint modes). We could do something similar for the persistent base attributes (e.g. `.sculpt_persistent_co` could be `sculpt_persistent_co` or something). I dunno.
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Reference: blender/blender#92944
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