Float Math Functions in GN and Shaders #94899

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Charlie Jolly · 2022-01-14T10:51:36+01:00

Charlie Jolly commented

2022-01-14 10:51:36 +01:00

Purpose of this task is to agree on how to extend math nodes in GN and Shader nodes and support float2 when it is added.

Reason: there is currently no way to run many math operations on float3 and float2 (when it is added), D13550: Nodes: Expand Math and Vector Math functions highlighted the need that there should be a design and agreement on how to do this.

Types of math operation:

Operations that scale to higher dimensions by component e.g. sin(), tanh() etc
Operations that rely on higher dimensions and are not applicable to a single float e.g. dot(), length(), cross()

User considerations:

Menu size, this is a problem as selecting an operation is slow. New search functionality such as link drag help
Power users want access to math functions on higher dimensions e.g. sign(), power(), exponent() etc...

Domain:

It makes more sense that GN can support more trig based functions e.g. angles, directions, intersections

Proposal:

In a similar way to recent changes to Map Range and Mix Node, extend existing Math node to support higher dimensions. This remains a common node for GN and Shaders.
Remove functions that operate on groups of floats from Vector Math node and version these to the Math node.
Allow Vector Math to diverge on GN and Shader.
Integer Math and Boolean Math remain separate nodes.

Purpose of this task is to agree on how to extend math nodes in GN and Shader nodes and support float2 when it is added. Reason: there is currently no way to run many math operations on float3 and float2 (when it is added), [D13550: Nodes: Expand Math and Vector Math functions](https://archive.blender.org/developer/D13550) highlighted the need that there should be a design and agreement on how to do this. Types of math operation: - Operations that scale to higher dimensions by component e.g. sin(), tanh() etc - Operations that rely on higher dimensions and are not applicable to a single float e.g. dot(), length(), cross() User considerations: - Menu size, this is a problem as selecting an operation is slow. New search functionality such as link drag help - Power users want access to math functions on higher dimensions e.g. sign(), power(), exponent() etc... Domain: - It makes more sense that GN can support more trig based functions e.g. angles, directions, intersections Proposal: - In a similar way to recent changes to Map Range and Mix Node, extend existing Math node to support higher dimensions. This remains a common node for GN and Shaders. - Remove functions that operate on groups of floats from Vector Math node and version these to the Math node. - Allow Vector Math to diverge on GN and Shader. - Integer Math and Boolean Math remain separate nodes.

Charlie Jolly commented

2022-01-14 10:51:36 +01:00

Added subscriber: @CharlieJolly

Charlie Jolly changed title from ~~Math Functions in GN and Shaders~~ to Float Math Functions in GN and Shaders

2022-01-14 11:07:50 +01:00

Hallam Roberts commented

2022-01-14 13:15:33 +01:00

Added subscriber: @MysteryPancake

Hallam Roberts commented

2022-01-14 13:15:33 +01:00

Maybe a data type dropdown could be added to "Math", like in Map Range and Mix:

It could be used to show/hide operations which only apply to higher dimensional data, such as dot(), length(), cross(), or lower dimensional data like integer operations.

This could make it possible to merge "Vector Math", "Integer Math" and "Boolean Math", since the data type could hide irrelevant operations

Maybe a data type dropdown could be added to "Math", like in Map Range and Mix: ![Layer 7 copy.png](https://archive.blender.org/developer/F12805193/Layer_7_copy.png) It could be used to show/hide operations which only apply to higher dimensional data, such as dot(), length(), cross(), or lower dimensional data like integer operations. This could make it possible to merge "Vector Math", "Integer Math" and "Boolean Math", since the data type could hide irrelevant operations

quvr commented

2022-01-14 14:44:09 +01:00

Added subscriber: @Quver

quvr commented

2022-01-14 14:44:09 +01:00

Reposting here my little feedback: Would be good to have dynamic sockets on some math operations to be able to input multiple values into one node. This would drastically reduce node trees clutter and won't take much space on the existing nodes (definitely less than using 2 nodes itself). Here is my quick mockup how that could look: $math.png$
+/- buttons add and remove additional sockets.
Of course those buttons will be available only on those operations where it's possible: add, subtract, multiply, divide, maximum, minimum.

Reposting here my little feedback: Would be good to have dynamic sockets on some math operations to be able to input multiple values into one node. This would drastically reduce node trees clutter and won't take much space on the existing nodes (definitely less than using 2 nodes itself). Here is my quick mockup how that could look: ![math.png](https://archive.blender.org/developer/F12805248/math.png) +/- buttons add and remove additional sockets. Of course those buttons will be available only on those operations where it's possible: add, subtract, multiply, divide, maximum, minimum.

Hallam Roberts commented

2022-01-14 14:53:21 +01:00

In #94899#1288148, @Quver wrote:
Would be good to have dynamic sockets on some math operations to be able to input multiple values into one node.
+/- buttons add and remove additional sockets.

I like this idea too, maybe using the multi-input from Geometry Join:

> In #94899#1288148, @Quver wrote: > Would be good to have dynamic sockets on some math operations to be able to input multiple values into one node. > +/- buttons add and remove additional sockets. I like this idea too, maybe using the multi-input from Geometry Join: ![image.png](https://archive.blender.org/developer/F12805256/image.png)

quvr commented

2022-01-14 15:03:30 +01:00

This looks even better (no additional buttons) but won't allow just typing numbers into the fields :(

Hallam Roberts commented

2022-01-14 15:16:28 +01:00

In #94899#1288159, @Quver wrote:
This looks even better (no additional buttons) but won't allow just typing numbers into the fields :(

Ah true, nevermind, yours is much better for editing the values :)

> In #94899#1288159, @Quver wrote: > This looks even better (no additional buttons) but won't allow just typing numbers into the fields :( Ah true, nevermind, yours is much better for editing the values :)

Paul Larson commented

2022-01-15 06:56:40 +01:00

Added subscriber: @GeorgiaPacific

Charlie Jolly commented

2022-11-08 18:19:31 +01:00

Notes from 2022-10-31 Geometry Nodes Post BCON22 Workshop
https://devtalk.blender.org/t/2022-10-31-geometry-nodes-post-bcon22-workshop/26491#math-nodes-15

Math Nodes

Split up the math node a bit. The ideal segmentation is arbitrary.
- We don’t want to use a node per operation because that makes switching more complicated, but the current math node has too many responsibilities.
Math node
- Does generic math operations
- Uses dynamic types
Vector math
- Only does operations that make sense on vectors
Compare node
- Dynamic type, generic or type-specific comparison operations
Needs more discussion

Notes from 2022-10-31 Geometry Nodes Post BCON22 Workshop https://devtalk.blender.org/t/2022-10-31-geometry-nodes-post-bcon22-workshop/26491#math-nodes-15 Math Nodes - Split up the math node a bit. The ideal segmentation is arbitrary. - We don’t want to use a node per operation because that makes switching more complicated, but the current math node has too many responsibilities. - Math node - Does generic math operations - Uses dynamic types - Vector math - Only does operations that make sense on vectors - Compare node - Dynamic type, generic or type-specific comparison operations - Needs more discussion

Philipp Oeser removed the

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Float Math Functions in GN and Shaders #94899