Blender 3.5.1 + Mac + Metal + Crash #106607
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Reference: blender/blender#106607
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System Information
Operating system: MONTEREY 12.6.3
Graphics card: AMD Radeon Pro 5500 XT 8 GB
Blender Version
Broken: Blender 3.5.1
Worked: Blender 3.4.1
Short description of error
Blender 3.4.1 will render a given scene with "RENDER PROPERTIES" -> "DEVICE" set to "GPU COMPUTE" in 1 min 58 sec
Blender 3.5 and 3.5.1 will crash on the same scene set on "RENDER PROPERTIES" -> "DEVICE" set to "GPU COMPUTE" -
It has to be run with "RENDER PROPERTIES" -> "DEVICE" set to "CP" and now takes 5 min 53 sec.
I have lost computing power with the latest versions.
Exact steps for others to reproduce the error
Just run the file with GPU BACKEND turned on and "RENDER PROPERTIES" -> "DEVICE" set to "GPU COMPUTE"
I could not include the file as it is a project I am working on - if there is no other way to check up on this issue I will try to create another file that I can send
The triage team needs to replicate the problem (and maybe reform and simplify the report) in order to forward it to the developers (in this case, the Cycles team).
It's a straightforward process, and it's not up to the triage team to investigate and resolve technical issues.
So I would need a file (preferably simplified) to be able to try to replicate it on the Mac I have available.
Thanks - I will create a new file and replicate the issue here - then send it to you
I have 3 files here
All the same scene, a free scene downloaded from CGTrader.
The scene in the folder "Blender 3.5.1 all Metal" crashed after a few minutes
...the image "3.5.1 Amount Rendered before crash.jpg" shows how much was rendered before the crash
...the image "3.5.1 Render Setup.jpg" and "3.5.1 System Prefs.jpg" show the system and render settings
------------------------------------------------
The scene in the folder "Blender 3.4.1 Metal" also has images for the system and render settings.
It rendered completely in 14 minutes - the final image is "CozyRoom-Render"
Let me know what else you might need from me.
I had to break the textures up into smaller files for upload - they apply to both scenes
Ric
The remaining texture files are in the comment that follows
Here are the remaining texture files
Thanks for the file. Now I can only test it on Monday. Someone else can confirm in the mean time
Thanks for the files, but I can't replicate the problem and unfortunately the scenario described is too time consuming for us to track down, we require the bug reporter to narrow down the problem.
Looking at the hardware, it is possible that this problem is related to the same one described in #106551 (Blender on Mac freezes when working on shader nodes).
As the file is complex, maybe it's worth waiting for this other issue to be fixed before testing again.
System Information
Operating system: macOS-13.2.1-arm64-arm-64bit 64 Bits
Graphics card: Metal API Apple M1 1.2
Germano
Thanks, I will try to render the file referenced in #106551 - just to see what happens, as well as my own with the latest builds.
In your opinion, do you think that this an AMD issue? And would a newer AMD card (as an eGPU) help?
Tried the new Blender build with the file I sent (above) and Blender with Metal enabled and GPU Metal backend on and it still crashes partway throough a render (single frame render)
I tried the file referenced #106551 and have no trouble maneuvering through that file or even rendering it.
### How do I get you a bug report?
In preliminary tests, it appears that I may have a solution.
In the "preferences" => "Cycles Render Devices" => "Matal Tab", I had "AMD Radeon Pro 5500 XT" selected AND "Intel Core 19-10910 CPU @ 3.60GHz" selected as well.
When I unchecked the "Intel Core...CPU" and rendered, there was NO Crash.
I thought I had to have them both selected to have a CPU and GPU available to the Application.
I guess not!
I'm not sure if another GPU from AMD will solve the problem.
Since the issue only occurs with mixed CPU + GPU rendering, it is possible that this is a memory issue (that the hardware has reached the limits of available RAM). In these cases GPUs with More VRAM can help.
But that doesn't explain why the same file works in 3.4.1 and not in 3.5.1
In addition to #106551, there is another issue related to AMD GPUs that is being investigated. See #106657
I image these are AMD issues, but I could not reproduce the issue cited in #106657
on my Intel Mac
iMac (Retina 5K, 27-inch, 2020)
3.6 GHz 10-Core Intel Core i9
128 GB 2667 MHz DDR4
AMD Radeon Pro 5500 XT 8 GB
Did you check if you also enabled the Intel CPU to render in blender 3.4.1?
Unless this is a regression, memory issues due to very complex scenes are not currently considered a bug.
Developers try to improve Blender to handle these cases of system running out of memory gracefully with error messages or something like that, but these cases are not always caught.
Yes, I have always - up til now, had both check boxes checked -
Germano - am I the only one with this issue?
It remains an issue even in today's build in the sample file "Victor" even with AMD Radeon..." Turned On and "Intel Core...CPU" turned off and Metal Checked.
My computer has plenty of RAM 128 GB - But the AMD video card has only 8 GB - How can I determine if the issue is video RAM? There is no feedback from Blender as to the issue.
This is becomming very frustrating - Blender 3.4.1 still works without crashing.
I it just a matter of AMD updating Drivers?
I tested it once, but as the file is so complex and takes a long time to render, I'm holding back from testing it again.
This report seems to fall under the "Too complex file report, where user could not simplify enough" scenario from Triaging_Playbook.
It also appears to be an "out of memory" issue (often not considered a bug unless it's a regression).
Recently there have been some improvements made to how Metal handles memory when rendering with Eevee, I'm not sure if this affects Cycles, but we can see that development in this area.
Have you checked if, by any chance, you enabled MetalRT in 3.5?
Thanks for getting back to me - MetalRT does not appear for me in version 3.5.1 downloaded 2 days ago on my intel Mac - is there another way to enable it?
Hi, does crash/freeze persist in 3.6-release?: https://builder.blender.org/download/daily/
Crash logs will help to identify the problem: https://docs.blender.org/manual/en/dev/troubleshooting/crash.html#macos
BTW, are you performing viewport rendering or is it a final render
Render > Render image/animaton
?it has been much better since the changes were made to the Metal back end.
But I find I must turn the render chunks (render memory) down to 512 or 256 (or less) for a complex or large render to be done without a crash.
So it does appear, at the moment, that 8 GB video ram is only barely enough.
I would love to know if anyone has had good luck with eGPU arrangements on the Mac, and whart the configuration is.....
Thanks.
These questions are still unanswered :/
As far as I understand, Cycles render is triggering the crash, right?
poke
I'm sorry, as I said above when it has crashed , I reduce the render chunks (render memory) and it seems to render through after that.
However - when it does crash again I will collect the crash report.
I will attempt to male it crash and send the report along.
I am now using Mac OS Venturea 13.4.1
I ran the file twice
the first time it did not crash but stopped render with the message that I was out of GPU memory that file is:
"Blender-2023-07-18-150652"
The second time it did crash and the report is: "Blender-2023-07-18-152121.txt"
And at that time Mac OS gace me a crash report that is: "Mac Os Crash of Blender Report"
that last file is here
Hi, thanks. Thread 51 crashed when rendering the scene.
How much memory your system have and how much is utilized during render?
Could be a crash due to memory management. Not very sure.
BTW, can you simplify the file and pack textures within the file?
To pack textures:
File > External Data > Pack Resources
-> save .blend fileThe computer has 128 GB Ram - The Video card has 8 GB video Ram
I will have to locate a new file that causes the same problem - I got this one online and it is missing some images and uses plugins I do not have.
Perhaps that caused the crash?
That could be the culprit. But hard to tell from crash logs because it has only reported the function calls related to rendering.
@Ric-Lopez hi, still encountering the crash in 4.1 beta?: https://builder.blender.org/download/daily/
I think we're good now I believe I had to change the render chunk size in order to keep the application from crashing