Shortcut to toggle the asset shelf region #107785

New Issue

Dalai Felinto · 2023-05-09T15:48:11+02:00

Dalai Felinto commented

2023-05-09 15:48:11 +02:00

This is to be implemented as part of the experimental option to use the Asset Shelf.

We will try to use the N shortcut to show a Pie Menu for the property/tools/asset shelf regions. It will try this as a user preference option at first. This will also free the T shortcut.

This is to be implemented as part of the experimental option to use the Asset Shelf. We will try to use the `N` shortcut to show a Pie Menu for the property/tools/asset shelf regions. It will try this as a user preference option at first. This will also free the `T` shortcut.

Dalai Felinto added the

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To Do

label 2023-05-09 15:48:11 +02:00

Dalai Felinto added this to the Brush Assets & Asset Shelf project 2023-05-09 15:48:12 +02:00

Dalai Felinto referenced this issue

2023-05-09 16:00:57 +02:00

Get pose library asset shelf ready for merge into main, experimental feature #107498

Julien Kaspar commented

2023-05-09 16:43:02 +02:00

As mentioned, an alternative could be to use the shortcut Ctrl Spacebar to toggle the asset shelf.
That would be less disruptive for the initial implementation of the asset shelf.

A pie menu for regions on N is a change in almost every editor and needs to be tested.
For example, areas that are close to the edge of the screen have a hard time using pie menus. The pie menu gets offset to fit on the screen, which leads to false mouse position inputs.

As mentioned, an alternative could be to use the shortcut `Ctrl Spacebar` to toggle the asset shelf. That would be less disruptive for the initial implementation of the asset shelf. A pie menu for regions on `N` is a change in almost every editor and needs to be tested. For example, areas that are close to the edge of the screen have a hard time using pie menus. The pie menu gets offset to fit on the screen, which leads to false mouse position inputs.

Julian Eisel commented

2023-05-09 16:58:25 +02:00

I'd suggest asking the animators first if they would use this even. And even if, this would indeed be an intrusive change that would have to be looked into for 4.0, and I honestly don't think it's a realistic change to happen. So I'd rather look into Ctrl Spacebar too, or something temporary for the pose library only to start with (while it's experimental).

I'd suggest asking the animators first if they would use this even. And even if, this would indeed be an intrusive change that would have to be looked into for 4.0, and I honestly don't think it's a realistic change to happen. So I'd rather look into `Ctrl Spacebar` too, or something temporary for the pose library only to start with (while it's experimental).

Dalai Felinto commented

2023-05-09 17:02:01 +02:00

But Ctrl Spacebar is already used to maximize the editor.

But `Ctrl Spacebar` is already used to maximize the editor.

Julien Kaspar commented

2023-05-09 17:18:54 +02:00

Sorry I meant Shift Spacebar, which is currently used for the Tools popup.
We'll need to look into how that works with the optional spacebar preferences, which then map Playback on Shift Spacebar but I'm sure there's a way to make it work.

Sorry I meant `Shift Spacebar`, which is currently used for the Tools popup. We'll need to look into how that works with the optional spacebar preferences, which then map Playback on `Shift Spacebar` but I'm sure there's a way to make it work.

Dalai Felinto changed title from ~~N-Pie Menu for the property/tools/asset shelf regions~~ to Shortcut to toggle the asset shelf region

2023-05-09 17:50:50 +02:00

Julian Eisel referenced this issue

2023-05-18 02:01:53 +02:00

UI: Asset Shelf (Experimental Feature) #104831

Julian Eisel commented

2023-05-19 14:43:32 +02:00

@JulienKaspar do you already have a plan on how we can get Shift Spacebar to work? Is this something you could look into?

@JulienKaspar do you already have a plan on how we can get `Shift` `Spacebar` to work? Is this something you could look into?

Julien Kaspar commented

2023-05-19 15:32:32 +02:00

Not exactly sure yet. My first idea was to use Shift Spacebar if the "Spacebar Action" is set to "Play".
If it's set to "Tools" or "Search", then playback will be set to Shift Spacebar and the asset shelf needs to be manually assigned a shortcut.

Not ideal.
This does give the Asset Shelf priority over the Tools popup. But it's also a new region that needs a univeral shortcut. The Toolbar already has one with T.

If we're fine with going futher with that, the Asset Shelf could replace the 'Tools' options in this preference entirely.

The wm.toolbar should be added to the View menu in the header. That way users can still access it and add a shortcut to it.

Not exactly sure yet. My first idea was to use `Shift Spacebar` if the "Spacebar Action" is set to "Play". If it's set to "Tools" or "Search", then playback will be set to `Shift Spacebar` and the asset shelf needs to be manually assigned a shortcut. ![image](/attachments/b03e3d7a-f7f0-47dd-89f9-b6f40fd8acad) Not ideal. This does give the Asset Shelf priority over the Tools popup. But it's also a new region that needs a univeral shortcut. The Toolbar already has one with `T`. If we're fine with going futher with that, the Asset Shelf could replace the 'Tools' options in this preference entirely. The `wm.toolbar` should be added to the `View` menu in the header. That way users can still access it and add a shortcut to it.

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Julien Kaspar commented

2023-05-20 15:12:35 +02:00

Here's a mockup of the pie menu (regions_pie_1).

Editors that don't have an Asset Shelf or Adjust Last Operation panel would lack those options.

We could go even bigger and include toggles to simplify the header (regions_pie_2). I found those options useful when working with many smaller areas in a workspace.

Or we leave it simple and only have the 4 main directions.

Here's a mockup of the pie menu (`regions_pie_1`). Editors that don't have an Asset Shelf or Adjust Last Operation panel would lack those options. We could go even bigger and include toggles to simplify the header (`regions_pie_2`). I found those options useful when working with many smaller areas in a workspace. Or we leave it simple and only have the 4 main directions.

regions_pie_1.png

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Dalai Felinto commented

2023-05-22 15:23:10 +02:00

I think overall simple is better. We can also add more options later. In other words, 4 options should be enough for now.

Dalai Felinto referenced this issue

2023-06-15 10:57:20 +02:00

Asset shelf UI Polish #107881

Julien Kaspar was assigned by Dalai Felinto

2023-06-15 11:42:46 +02:00

Dalai Felinto added this to the 4.0 milestone 2023-06-15 11:42:54 +02:00

Nika Kutsniashvili commented

2023-06-23 19:27:45 +02:00

Changing what N does is extremely disruptive, we have muscle memory for that key, and bringing Sidebar is probably most often repeated action in Blender for anyone who uses addons. I propose End key

It is not used by anything except text fields to move cursor to the end
It is somewhat intuitive for UI that pops up at the bottom of the screen

Changing what N does is extremely disruptive, we have muscle memory for that key, and bringing Sidebar is probably most often repeated action in Blender for anyone who uses addons. I propose End key 1. It is not used by anything except text fields to move cursor to the end 2. It is somewhat intuitive for UI that pops up at the bottom of the screen

Julien Kaspar commented

2023-06-27 17:32:49 +02:00

If we go for a pie menu we need to improve where pie menus are drawn when executed near the edge of the screen. That is the main issue imo.

@ideasman42 What is your opinion on using the shortcut Shift Spacebar by default for toggling the asset shelf instead of the tool popup?

Not exactly sure yet. My first idea was to use Shift Spacebar if the "Spacebar Action" is set to "Play".
If it's set to "Tools" or "Search", then playback will be set to Shift Spacebar and the asset shelf needs to be manually assigned a shortcut.

Not ideal.
This does give the Asset Shelf priority over the Tools popup. But it's also a new region that needs a univeral shortcut. The Toolbar already has one with T.

If we're fine with going futher with that, the Asset Shelf could replace the 'Tools' options in this preference entirely.

The wm.toolbar should be added to the View menu in the header. That way users can still access it and add a shortcut to it.

If we go for a pie menu we need to improve where pie menus are drawn when executed near the edge of the screen. That is the main issue imo. --- @ideasman42 What is your opinion on using the shortcut `Shift Spacebar` by default for toggling the asset shelf instead of the tool popup? > Not exactly sure yet. My first idea was to use `Shift Spacebar` if the "Spacebar Action" is set to "Play". > If it's set to "Tools" or "Search", then playback will be set to `Shift Spacebar` and the asset shelf needs to be manually assigned a shortcut. > > ![image](/attachments/b03e3d7a-f7f0-47dd-89f9-b6f40fd8acad) > > Not ideal. > This does give the Asset Shelf priority over the Tools popup. But it's also a new region that needs a univeral shortcut. The Toolbar already has one with `T`. > > If we're fine with going futher with that, the Asset Shelf could replace the 'Tools' options in this preference entirely. > > The `wm.toolbar` should be added to the `View` menu in the header. That way users can still access it and add a shortcut to it.

Campbell Barton commented

2023-07-07 09:48:30 +02:00

@JulienKaspar I'm not so keen on having no way to switch tool shortcuts by default, but I think a pie menu would be intrusive/annoying.

We could consider making either N or T modifier keys.

T (tap) could toggle the toolbar.
T-A could toggle assets.

Or N, N-A could be used, T-A has the advantage that it can be done with only the left hand on a QWERTY layout.

In the past we found using "release" keyboard events to feel delayed, but this is mostly an issue for actions you expect to be immediate (such as selection, toggling edit-mode). Toggling a panel animates and I don't think running on release is going to be perceived as slowing users down.

So we could consider it for toggling UI elements since it has the advantage that we can toggle other UI elements without conflicting with keys assigned in other parts of Blender.

@JulienKaspar I'm not so keen on having no way to switch tool shortcuts by default, but I think a pie menu would be intrusive/annoying. We could consider making either `N` or `T` modifier keys. - `T` (tap) could toggle the toolbar. - `T-A` could toggle assets. _Or `N`, `N-A` could be used, `T-A` has the advantage that it can be done with only the left hand on a QWERTY layout._ In the past we found using "release" keyboard events to feel delayed, but this is mostly an issue for actions you expect to be immediate (such as selection, toggling edit-mode). Toggling a panel animates and I don't think running on release is going to be perceived as slowing users down. So we could consider it for toggling UI elements since it has the advantage that we can toggle other UI elements without conflicting with keys assigned in other parts of Blender.

Julien Kaspar commented

2023-07-12 19:37:11 +02:00

We could consider making either N or T modifier keys.

@ideasman42
Regular keyboard keys as modifier keys never really worked so well imo and are are rare in the default keymap. It also makes these shortcuts very hidden and obscure in particular.

When it comes to having an option to switch tool shortcuts, I think the Alt Click Tool Prompt preference is more direct and easier to use for that purpose. IMO that option should always stick around for people who want to be able to access both Tools & Modal operators with shortcuts.

The Toolbar popup could also be added to the header menus so people can add it back in modes/editors where needed. Or one of the preference configurations can specifically be to use Shift Spacebar for the Tools and Spacebar for playback.
But the default could be to assign it to the Asset Shelf. What do you think?

The reason why I propose to use the Shift Spacebar shortcut for the asset shelf instead, is because the only cases that I've seen where users wanted to actively use the Toolbar popup, is to access brushes. The asset shelf is aiming to address that use case with a UI that fits that use better.

> We could consider making either N or T modifier keys. @ideasman42 Regular keyboard keys as modifier keys never really worked so well imo and are are rare in the default keymap. It also makes these shortcuts very hidden and obscure in particular. When it comes to having an option to switch tool shortcuts, I think the `Alt Click Tool Prompt` preference is more direct and easier to use for that purpose. IMO that option should always stick around for people who want to be able to access both Tools & Modal operators with shortcuts. The Toolbar popup could also be added to the header menus so people can add it back in modes/editors where needed. Or one of the preference configurations can specifically be to use `Shift Spacebar` for the Tools and `Spacebar` for playback. But the default could be to assign it to the Asset Shelf. What do you think? The reason why I propose to use the `Shift Spacebar` shortcut for the asset shelf instead, is because the only cases that I've seen where users wanted to actively use the Toolbar popup, is to access brushes. The asset shelf is aiming to address that use case with a UI that fits that use better.

👍 1

Campbell Barton commented

2023-07-14 14:02:13 +02:00

I'm still concerned with removing toolbar key is it means a couple of things.

Removing shortcut for tool access undermines tools somewhat for an efficient workflow.
Accessing brushes is clearly something you want to do frequently in sculpt mode, but possibly not in other modes, so it's taking what is currently a shared/global shortcut and using it for something that might not be so useful in edit-mode for e.g.
In general, having UI toggling options is taking up more shortcuts than they might:
- N toggle side-bar.
- T toggle toobar.
- Ctrl-Space toggle maximized (arguably not toggling a UI element, still it's a convenient shortcut used for the UI).
  ... with the suggestion to add another.

We could consider ways to reduce the number of keys used to toggle UI elements as this frees up those keys for tools/operators so users can access them as part of their workflow.

Attached a patch that uses a pie on T-key (tapping still toggles the toolbar), T-drag shows the pie menu. Testing it now it seems OK, with the pie directions matching the UI elements (it can toggle the header too). If we go with something like this we could free up the N key for other uses too.

I'm still concerned with removing toolbar key is it means a couple of things. - Removing shortcut for tool access undermines tools somewhat for an efficient workflow. - Accessing brushes is clearly something you want to do frequently in sculpt mode, but possibly not in other modes, so it's taking what is currently a shared/global shortcut and using it for something that might not be so useful in edit-mode for e.g. - In general, having UI toggling options is taking up more shortcuts than they might: - `N` toggle side-bar. - `T` toggle toobar. - Ctrl-Space toggle maximized (arguably not toggling a UI element, still it's a convenient shortcut used for the UI). ... with the suggestion to add another. We could consider ways to reduce the number of keys used to toggle UI elements as this frees up those keys for tools/operators so users can access them as part of their workflow. Attached a patch that uses a pie on T-key (tapping still toggles the toolbar), T-drag shows the pie menu. Testing it now it seems OK, with the pie directions matching the UI elements (it can toggle the header too). If we go with something like this we could free up the N key for other uses too.

pie_on_t_key.diff

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Nika Kutsniashvili commented

2023-07-14 14:40:05 +02:00

Attached a patch that uses a pie on T-key (tapping still toggles the toolbar), T-drag shows the pie menu. Testing it now it seems OK, with the pie directions matching the UI elements (it can toggle the header too). If we go with something like this we could free up the N key for other uses too.

Accessing brushes and tools is very frequently done by drawing tablets. I have one of the tablet keys assigned to Shift+Spacebar. Having Key+Drag makes it awkward for tablets and hard to use. To be easily accessible on drawing and graphic tablets I think it just needs to be a key, or combination, like Alt+Spacebar, End, or something like that, so that you make it pop up with single click

> Attached a patch that uses a pie on T-key (tapping still toggles the toolbar), T-drag shows the pie menu. Testing it now it seems OK, with the pie directions matching the UI elements (it can toggle the header too). If we go with something like this we could free up the N key for other uses too. > Accessing brushes and tools is very frequently done by drawing tablets. I have one of the tablet keys assigned to Shift+Spacebar. Having Key+Drag makes it awkward for tablets and hard to use. To be easily accessible on drawing and graphic tablets I think it just needs to be a key, or combination, like Alt+Spacebar, End, or something like that, so that you make it pop up with single click

Campbell Barton commented

2023-07-15 08:40:11 +02:00

@Nika-Kutsniashvili there are some possibilities for this to be assigned direct keys although I'm not sure how much we should avoid pie-menus for the sake of tablet users (we already use pie menu for view shading switching & snapping, if we consider them "tablet hostile" then it would seem we already have problems). There are some alternatives shortcuts we could consider, but I rather brainstorm a bit which isn't so practical here, I'll check with others and see if we can come up with something.

@Nika-Kutsniashvili there are some possibilities for this to be assigned direct keys although I'm not sure how much we should avoid pie-menus for the sake of tablet users (we already use pie menu for view shading switching & snapping, if we consider them _"tablet hostile"_ then it would seem we already have problems). There are some alternatives shortcuts we could consider, but I rather brainstorm a bit which isn't so practical here, I'll check with others and see if we can come up with something.

Julien Kaspar commented

2023-07-21 17:49:28 +02:00

@ideasman42 and I talked about this and a good thing to try is to use the T key for the regions pie menu and remove the N shortcut.
This will at first be an option in the keymap preferences.

@ideasman42 and I talked about this and a good thing to try is to use the `T` key for the regions pie menu and remove the `N` shortcut. This will at first be an option in the keymap preferences.

Dalai Felinto commented

2023-07-24 11:03:13 +02:00

@JulienKaspar shouldn't be the other way around? N is used universally in the editors, while T is supported only in a handful. For example all the animation editors use T for something else (extrapolation).

Julien Kaspar commented

2023-07-24 11:06:48 +02:00

@dfelinto That's a good point. Also N would fit better for this pie menu that potentially isn't used that frequently. Keys on the left of the keyboard like T would be great to have free and reserved for custom user shortcuts that they use far more often.

@dfelinto That's a good point. Also `N` would fit better for this pie menu that potentially isn't used that frequently. Keys on the left of the keyboard like `T` would be great to have free and reserved for custom user shortcuts that they use far more often.

Dalai Felinto commented

2023-07-24 11:24:16 +02:00

Ok, updated the task description

Campbell Barton referenced this issue from a commit

2023-07-26 07:25:32 +02:00

Keymap: add experimental "Toolbar Toggle Pie" preference

Campbell Barton commented

2023-07-26 07:27:59 +02:00

Implemented the pie menu as an experimental keymap preference: ab7161e41a

Implemented the pie menu as an experimental keymap preference: ab7161e41a0ea6e5645524e6344a5410c06f2143

❤️ 1

Nahuel Belich commented

2023-07-26 08:56:21 +02:00

niiiice, this is a cool one, i can see that people that doesn't use or like pie menus may not like but its really cool, set as default for now :) thanks

By the way, i use a wacom intuos 4 for working since 2009 and using pie menus since were introduced as an addon, it works fine for me, maybe im too used to use it, if it was my call i would also like to see the F1 F12 editors switch as pie + all the rest of things that have less than nine options im happy with it, but as i said before i can imagine that controlling pie menus with stylus may not be for everyone.

the video its real time, not a timelapse or speed up

It doesn't work too well near the bottom or top or sides of the screen, so as an important area toogle in the default blender mmm its hard to justify, i can use it as an experimental feature but the pie menu would need a polish to work better in other than "the center of the screen"

niiiice, this is a cool one, i can see that people that doesn't use or like pie menus may not like but its really cool, set as default for now :) thanks By the way, i use a wacom intuos 4 for working since 2009 and using pie menus since were introduced as an addon, it works fine for me, maybe im too used to use it, if it was my call i would also like to see the F1 F12 editors switch as pie + all the rest of things that have less than nine options im happy with it, but as i said before i can imagine that controlling pie menus with stylus may not be for everyone. the video its real time, not a timelapse or speed up <video src="/attachments/dbc332ce-4933-4bb1-88dd-c9e8f6e98652" title="Screencast from 26-07-23 03:25:05.m4v" controls></video> It doesn't work too well near the bottom or top or sides of the screen, so as an important area toogle in the default blender mmm its hard to justify, i can use it as an experimental feature but the pie menu would need a polish to work better in other than "the center of the screen" <video src="/attachments/de8f3a9f-00f1-4d16-bfee-a2da6e840cc7" title="2023-07-26 03-50-52.mp4" controls></video>

Screencast from 26-07-23 03:25:05.m4v

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2023-07-26 03-50-52.mp4

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👍 1

Julien Kaspar commented

2023-07-26 12:31:13 +02:00

@ideasman42 Perfect 👍
My only suggestion is to not call it "Toolbar Toggle Pie: and "Toggle Toolbars".
Toolbar is only one of the 4 regions it would eventually toggle. So it could instead refer to "Regions" instead of "Toolbars"

We should eventually also support more editors with the pie menu.
The animation editors should have the left pie menu entry for the Channels region.
The asset and file browser could also have support for its Header, Properties and Source List regions.

@ideasman42 Perfect 👍 My only suggestion is to not call it "Toolbar Toggle Pie: and "Toggle Toolbars". Toolbar is only one of the 4 regions it would eventually toggle. So it could instead refer to "Regions" instead of "Toolbars" We should eventually also support more editors with the pie menu. The animation editors should have the left pie menu entry for the Channels region. The asset and file browser could also have support for its Header, Properties and Source List regions.

👍 1

Campbell Barton commented

2023-08-10 05:45:37 +02:00

Done, think this can be closed, we can discuss changing defaults separately.

Campbell Barton closed this issue

2023-08-10 05:45:39 +02:00

Blender Bot added the

Status

Archived

label 2023-08-10 05:46:18 +02:00

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