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Blender Frozen in 3.6 and 4.0 after Adding DoF in EEVEE on newest macOS version (14.0) #113086

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opened 2023-09-30 15:14:19 +02:00 by Andrew · 31 comments
Andrew commented 2023-09-30 15:14:19 +02:00
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System Information
Operating system: macOS 14.0
Graphics card: AMD Radeon Pro 5300 4 GB

Blender Version
Broken: All 3.6 and 4.0 builds

Adding DoF in EEVEE and viewing the camera view in EEVEE or material preview freezes Blender on macOS 14.0.

Exact steps for others to reproduce the error
Open Mac
Download 14.0 OS
Open any 3.6 or 4.0 build of Blender
Make a cube or any mesh
Add a camera
Go into the Material Preview tab
Check the DoF checkbox in camera settings
^^Lagging should occur immediately

**System Information** Operating system: macOS 14.0 Graphics card: AMD Radeon Pro 5300 4 GB **Blender Version** Broken: All 3.6 and 4.0 builds Adding DoF in EEVEE and viewing the camera view in EEVEE or material preview freezes Blender on macOS 14.0. **Exact steps for others to reproduce the error** Open Mac Download 14.0 OS Open any 3.6 or 4.0 build of Blender Make a cube or any mesh Add a camera Go into the Material Preview tab Check the DoF checkbox in camera settings ^^Lagging should occur immediately
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Andrew added the
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 labels 2023-09-30 15:14:20 +02:00
Andrew commented 2023-10-01 15:04:01 +02:00
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Confirm: Issue is only in 3.6 and 4.0 builds. 3.5 works fine.

Confirm: Issue is only in 3.6 and 4.0 builds. 3.5 works fine.
Pratik Borhade added the
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macOS
 label 2023-10-02 05:37:18 +02:00
Andrew commented 2023-10-11 22:04:10 +02:00
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Any reports regarding this from other users?

Any reports regarding this from other users?
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Michael Parkin-White commented 2023-10-12 23:38:41 +02:00
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Thanks for the report Andrew, I can have a look into this and get back to you once i'm able to reproduce.

Thanks for the report Andrew, I can have a look into this and get back to you once i'm able to reproduce.
Felipe-Vargas-2 commented 2023-11-06 22:32:17 +01:00
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Yes is a bad thing.
I hope Blender guys fix it soon.

Yes is a bad thing. I hope Blender guys fix it soon.
Michael Parkin-White commented 2023-11-06 23:53:28 +01:00
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Just to check on this, do you recall if this happened in v3.6 on macOS 13.x?

Thanks!

Just to check on this, do you recall if this happened in v3.6 on macOS 13.x? Thanks!
Pratik Borhade commented 2023-11-07 04:55:58 +01:00
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@Michael-Parkin-White-Apple , as described in #114556, problem seems specific on macOS 14

Worked: (3.6.1 with Ventura Os)
With the version of the previous operating system (Ventura 13.6) this problem did not occur.

@Michael-Parkin-White-Apple , as described in #114556, problem seems specific on macOS 14 > Worked: (3.6.1 with Ventura Os) > With the version of the previous operating system (Ventura 13.6) this problem did not occur.
Andrew commented 2023-11-07 13:10:02 +01:00
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@Michael-Parkin-White-Apple : I can confirm: 13.x OS and previous versions had no issues.

@Michael-Parkin-White-Apple : I can confirm: 13.x OS and previous versions had no issues.
Michael Parkin-White commented 2023-11-07 13:47:36 +01:00
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Thanks for the information, that helps!

Thanks for the information, that helps!
TonyG commented 2023-11-15 04:26:44 +01:00
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I can confirm, no issue in MacOS 12.5, using Blender 4.0.

@Andrew-Herman can you reproduce the issue in Blender 3.6 and choosing "OpenGL" in Preferences > System > GPU Backend ?

I can confirm, no issue in MacOS 12.5, using Blender 4.0. @Andrew-Herman can you reproduce the issue in Blender 3.6 and choosing "OpenGL" in Preferences > System > GPU Backend ?
Andrew commented 2023-11-15 13:56:42 +01:00
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@antoine.grasset:

Yes. While the whole application doesn't lock up/freeze as it did with the Metal backend, there is still heavy lagging, increasing exponentially as DoF intensity increases.

@antoine.grasset: Yes. While the whole application doesn't lock up/freeze as it did with the Metal backend, there is still heavy lagging, increasing exponentially as DoF intensity increases.
Andrew commented 2023-11-15 13:58:25 +01:00
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Just tested the official release of 4.0: Issue persists still.

Just tested the official release of 4.0: Issue persists still.
Pratik Borhade added the
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Metal
 label 2023-12-08 10:25:32 +01:00
Jesse Yurkovich commented 2023-12-29 20:34:13 +01:00
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Based on the number of duplicates that are still coming in for this let's confirm at least.

Based on the number of duplicates that are still coming in for this let's confirm at least.
Jesse Yurkovich added
Module
EEVEE & Viewport
Status
Confirmed
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Status
Needs Triage
 labels 2023-12-29 20:34:26 +01:00
ZeeshanYousuf commented 2024-01-26 14:41:32 +01:00
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I have just realised that there is a post on this issue so I will just copy and paste my issue article that I was writing already, and copy and paste it here

Issue: Depth of Field causes Blender to 'freeze' when turned on, even for the simplest files.

System 1 Information - my main professional machine
Device: Retina, 13-inch MacBook Air, 2018
CPU: 1.6 GHz Dual-Core Intel Core i5
Operating system: MacOS Sonoma 14.1/14.2/14.3
Graphics card: AMD Radeon RX 5700XT 8GB (via eGPU Razer Core X) is the main, Intel UHD 630 (never used)
RAM: 16GB 2133MHz LPDDR3

System 2 Information
Device: 2018 Mac Mini
CPU: 3.2 GHz 6-Core Intel Core i7
Operating system: MacOS Sonoma 14.2/14.3
Graphics card: AMD Radeon VII 16GB (via eGPU) is the main, Intel UHD 630 (never used)
RAM: 64GB 2666Hz DDR4

Blender Version
Broken: 3.6??, but definitely Blender 4.0.0/4.0.1/4.0.2
Worked: Must've been somewhere down 3.5/3.6?

Short (not) description of error

Context:

I have been using Blender for a pretty long time (since 2018, version 2.79) and I have used Blender across a variety of Macintoshes. Specifically, I have mainly used the Eevee renderer to produce my content for my professional role which involves CG video content for marketing. I've ran my fair share of really heavy and intense files, with 500+ samples, too many triangles to count, Screen Space Reflections to the max, etc and I think I've played and understood every Eevee renderer setting under the sun. I haven't used Depth of Field for about 3 months, so when my recent client requested a stylish hyperrealistic composition, I tried using Depth of Field on Blender 4.0.1, which is a feature on the Camera object, and my file, 100% of the time, freezes. It's a super strange phenomenon.

** MAIN: How I encountered the issue: **

The way I came about this issue was that I built a whole scene in Blender 4.0.1 for Intel MacOS, and when I was setting up my cameras, I enabled Depth of Field (clicked the checkbox), the rainbow loading wheel did its thing for a minute, my mouse icon returned, and then my whole viewport was unresponsive. I had left my Eevee depth of field settings as is (default, so max size 100px, etc), so nothing too extreme, I have run heavier scenes before, so this situation was unusual.

I've experienced many many many species of Blender crashes, many times, during my lifetime, but usually, Blender either flashes green or red on the viewport, then the application force quits itself, or you'll get the classic MacOS 'Application not Responding' message whilst the app is open, and the rainbow wheel of death does its thing. But here, the viewport is frozen, you can't rotate the viewport at all, the viewport samples are really low (so its not even the fact that it's waiting to finish samples before the viewport becomes responsive again) I can't scroll up and down on any of the menus and layers, etc... the whole app is 'frozen' but yet, when I hover my mouse on certain parts of the interface, it changes based on where I am hovering (the cursor icon changes to the 4 directional arrows, or the slider etc) but once again, no rotation possible of the viewport, no scrolling of the menus, etc, no buttons work.

How to Replicate:

The above was how I came about the issue, so I tried to see if maybe the issue was 'file specific'.

Nope.

I opened up Blender onto the default scene, and didn't delete anything. I totally left everything as-is, and I switched to Eevee, switched to render view, as I always do, went onto the camera settings, enabled depth of field. No issues here, because the focus distance is 10m and obviously you have no bokeh appearing because everything is sort-of in focus. I started dragging the distance in, rainbow wheel of death, mouse comes back, viewport is unresponsive, nothing is scrollable. I click on the Blender icon on my dock, it doesn't say 'Application is not Responding', it just says ... well the default stuff, 'Quit', etc. I click on quit, Blender doesn't want to quit, so I have to force quit it every time, to be able to use it again.

I did some research, over and beyond what I already knew about the depth of field feature, and cranked the settings pretty low and then turned max size of the bokeh (blur) was 10px so I could still see it, and the issue still persists, the 'freeze' happens again.

I was experiencing these issues on my System 1*, so I switched to a much more powerful machine than mine (System 2*) to see perhaps maybe Blender's performance requirements had suddenly changed (even though my machine was a lot more substantial than the old 2012 Macs I've used Eevee on before).

More stuff:

The issue still persists. I cannot use Depth of Field on any Mac. This is an urgent issue I have been experiencing for the last month, and it hasn't been resolved with Blender 4.0.0/4.0.1/4.0.2 (the latest as of writing). So somewhere down the 3.6 release (maybe) or definitely down the 4.0.0 chain has this issue arisen I believe, since I haven't used depth of field since then. Please fix asap guys, I need DoF to work again, I can't rebuild my scenes in an old blender version.

So turns out, I've found a post by an Andrew which mentions the same problem, I wonder how many other professional users are experiencing the same problem. This issue SUCKS :(

**I have just realised that there is a post on this issue so I will just copy and paste my issue article that I was writing already, and copy and paste it here** Issue: Depth of Field causes Blender to 'freeze' when turned on, even for the simplest files. **System 1 Information** - my main professional machine Device: Retina, 13-inch MacBook Air, 2018 CPU: 1.6 GHz Dual-Core Intel Core i5 Operating system: MacOS Sonoma 14.1/14.2/14.3 Graphics card: AMD Radeon RX 5700XT 8GB (via eGPU Razer Core X) is the main, Intel UHD 630 (never used) RAM: 16GB 2133MHz LPDDR3 **System 2 Information** Device: 2018 Mac Mini CPU: 3.2 GHz 6-Core Intel Core i7 Operating system: MacOS Sonoma 14.2/14.3 Graphics card: AMD Radeon VII 16GB (via eGPU) is the main, Intel UHD 630 (never used) RAM: 64GB 2666Hz DDR4 **Blender Version** Broken: 3.6??, but definitely Blender 4.0.0/4.0.1/4.0.2 Worked: Must've been somewhere down 3.5/3.6? **Short (not) description of error** Context: I have been using Blender for a pretty long time (since 2018, version 2.79) and I have used Blender across a variety of Macintoshes. Specifically, I have mainly used the Eevee renderer to produce my content for my professional role which involves CG video content for marketing. I've ran my fair share of really heavy and intense files, with 500+ samples, too many triangles to count, Screen Space Reflections to the max, etc and I think I've played and understood every Eevee renderer setting under the sun. I haven't used Depth of Field for about 3 months, so when my recent client requested a stylish hyperrealistic composition, I tried using Depth of Field on Blender 4.0.1, which is a feature on the Camera object, and my file, 100% of the time, freezes. It's a super strange phenomenon. ** MAIN: How I encountered the issue: ** The way I came about this issue was that I built a whole scene in Blender 4.0.1 for Intel MacOS, and when I was setting up my cameras, I enabled Depth of Field (clicked the checkbox), the rainbow loading wheel did its thing for a minute, my mouse icon returned, and then my whole viewport was unresponsive. I had left my Eevee depth of field settings as is (default, so max size 100px, etc), so nothing too extreme, I have run heavier scenes before, so this situation was unusual. I've experienced many many many species of Blender crashes, many times, during my lifetime, but usually, Blender either flashes green or red on the viewport, then the application force quits itself, or you'll get the classic MacOS 'Application not Responding' message whilst the app is open, and the rainbow wheel of death does its thing. But here, the viewport is frozen, you can't rotate the viewport at all, the viewport samples are really low (so its not even the fact that it's waiting to finish samples before the viewport becomes responsive again) I can't scroll up and down on any of the menus and layers, etc... the whole app is 'frozen' but yet, when I hover my mouse on certain parts of the interface, it changes based on where I am hovering (the cursor icon changes to the 4 directional arrows, or the slider etc) but once again, no rotation possible of the viewport, no scrolling of the menus, etc, no buttons work. **How to Replicate:** The above was how I came about the issue, so I tried to see if maybe the issue was 'file specific'. Nope. I opened up Blender onto the default scene, and didn't delete anything. I totally left everything as-is, and I switched to Eevee, switched to render view, as I always do, went onto the camera settings, enabled depth of field. No issues here, because the focus distance is 10m and obviously you have no bokeh appearing because everything is sort-of in focus. I started dragging the distance in, rainbow wheel of death, mouse comes back, viewport is unresponsive, nothing is scrollable. I click on the Blender icon on my dock, it doesn't say 'Application is not Responding', it just says ... well the default stuff, 'Quit', etc. I click on quit, Blender doesn't want to quit, so I have to force quit it every time, to be able to use it again. I did some research, over and beyond what I already knew about the depth of field feature, and cranked the settings pretty low and then turned max size of the bokeh (blur) was 10px so I could still see it, and the issue still persists, the 'freeze' happens again. I was experiencing these issues on my System 1*, so I switched to a much more powerful machine than mine (System 2*) to see perhaps maybe Blender's performance requirements had suddenly changed (even though my machine was a lot more substantial than the old 2012 Macs I've used Eevee on before). More stuff: The issue still persists. I cannot use Depth of Field on any Mac. This is an urgent issue I have been experiencing for the last month, and it hasn't been resolved with Blender 4.0.0/4.0.1/4.0.2 (the latest as of writing). So somewhere down the 3.6 release (maybe) or definitely down the 4.0.0 chain has this issue arisen I believe, since I haven't used depth of field since then. Please fix asap guys, I need DoF to work again, I can't rebuild my scenes in an old blender version. So turns out, I've found a post by an Andrew which mentions the same problem, I wonder how many other professional users are experiencing the same problem. This issue SUCKS :(
ZeeshanYousuf commented 2024-01-26 14:42:36 +01:00
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Could you upgrade the priority, please?

Could you upgrade the priority, please?
ZeeshanYousuf commented 2024-01-26 14:44:14 +01:00
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BTW this is a metal issue

BTW this is a metal issue
Andrew commented 2024-01-26 15:03:07 +01:00
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@ZeeshanYousuf: Exact same problem on my end. Based on what I've seen, the lagging appears to become exponentially worse depending on how much DoF I'm trying to produce. Higher f-stops = less lag, lower f-stops = more lag. Regardless, any time I use DoF, regardless of f-stop values, it always freezes up Blender.

@ZeeshanYousuf: Exact same problem on my end. Based on what I've seen, the lagging appears to become exponentially worse depending on how much DoF I'm trying to produce. Higher f-stops = less lag, lower f-stops = more lag. Regardless, any time I use DoF, regardless of f-stop values, it always freezes up Blender.
ZeeshanYousuf commented 2024-01-26 15:35:18 +01:00
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@Andrew-Herman for me, it literally doesn’t matter what f-stop I’m using, blender will straight up just freeze. You also mentioned lag, but blender for me will just refuse to become responsive ever again. That’s the extent of my problem.

BTW, I really appreciate this post being created: when I was on the internet, it seemed like the newest issue for this problem was this ancient 2019 post for Blender 2.80 and MacOS, but it seems a few of us have the same issue on this DoF thing. Still, its annoying because I use blender professionally and DoF is so important :/

@Andrew-Herman for me, it literally doesn’t matter what f-stop I’m using, blender will straight up just freeze. You also mentioned lag, but blender for me will just refuse to become responsive ever again. That’s the extent of my problem. BTW, I really appreciate this post being created: when I was on the internet, it seemed like the newest issue for this problem was this ancient 2019 post for Blender 2.80 and MacOS, but it seems a few of us have the same issue on this DoF thing. Still, its annoying because I use blender professionally and DoF is so important :/
👍 1
Pratik Borhade commented 2024-02-02 10:22:26 +01:00
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Raising the priority for attention since it's easy to encounter this problem. And also good to have this fixed before 4.1 release

Raising the priority for attention since it's easy to encounter this problem. And also good to have this fixed before 4.1 release
🎉 2
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 labels 2024-02-02 10:22:36 +01:00
Michael Parkin-White commented 2024-02-02 13:58:48 +01:00
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Will have a look at this with higher priority, as there do appear to be a number of reports surrounding this.

Will have a look at this with higher priority, as there do appear to be a number of reports surrounding this.
Thomas Dinges commented 2024-03-12 11:17:21 +01:00
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Any update here? 4.1 will be released in one week and it would be great if this can be fixed :)

Any update here? 4.1 will be released in one week and it would be great if this can be fixed :)
ZeeshanYousuf commented 2024-03-12 12:16:53 +01:00
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@ThomasDinges

I hope so too :/

@ThomasDinges I hope so too :/
Michael Parkin-White commented 2024-03-12 12:30:54 +01:00
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Unfortunately, i'm still unable to reproduce this locally. However, there was a similar issue with the ambient occlusion affecting AMD platforms in the past.

The solution in this case was to disable inlining for select functions. I'm currently unable to verify this, but still working on attempting to reproduce, but it may be possible to tag several of the functions in source/blender/draw/engines/eevee/shaders/effect_dof_lib.glsl

with:

#if (defined(GPU_METAL) && defined(GPU_ATI))
__attribute__((noinline))
#endif

If I had to "guess" which functions could be effective, possibly any of these:

void dof_gather_accumulate_sample_pair(..)
void dof_gather_accumulate_sample(..)
void dof_gather_accumulate_sample_ring(..)
vec4 median_filter(sampler2D tex, vec2 uv); (in `source/blender/draw/engines/eevee/shaders/effect_dof_filter_frag.glsl`)
void dof_gather_accumulator(..) (in `source/blender/draw/engines/eevee/shaders/effect_dof_gather_frag.glsl`)
void dof_slight_focus_gather(..)
Unfortunately, i'm still unable to reproduce this locally. However, there was a similar issue with the ambient occlusion affecting AMD platforms in the past. The solution in this case was to disable inlining for select functions. I'm currently unable to verify this, but still working on attempting to reproduce, but it may be possible to tag several of the functions in `source/blender/draw/engines/eevee/shaders/effect_dof_lib.glsl` with: ``` #if (defined(GPU_METAL) && defined(GPU_ATI)) __attribute__((noinline)) #endif ``` If I had to "guess" which functions could be effective, possibly any of these: ``` void dof_gather_accumulate_sample_pair(..) void dof_gather_accumulate_sample(..) void dof_gather_accumulate_sample_ring(..) vec4 median_filter(sampler2D tex, vec2 uv); (in `source/blender/draw/engines/eevee/shaders/effect_dof_filter_frag.glsl`) void dof_gather_accumulator(..) (in `source/blender/draw/engines/eevee/shaders/effect_dof_gather_frag.glsl`) void dof_slight_focus_gather(..) ```
Brecht Van Lommel commented 2024-03-13 18:50:03 +01:00
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For reference, I was unable to reproduce this on macOS 14.3 with a AMD Radeon W6800X.

For reference, I was unable to reproduce this on macOS 14.3 with a AMD Radeon W6800X.
Alper Özgün Yeşil commented 2024-03-14 10:46:49 +01:00
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i suffer because of the same problem, there is no way to open depth of field on camera. So there is no way to take any good render. We need a fix ASAP.

My system is: MacBook Pro 2019/ 2,3 GHz 8 Çekirdekli Intel Core i9 / AMD Radeon RX 6800 XT 16 GB / 32 GB 2667 MHz DDR4

Btw I just tried RC version of 4.1.0, but there is no improvement on the horizon...

i suffer because of the same problem, there is no way to open depth of field on camera. So there is no way to take any good render. We need a fix ASAP. My system is: MacBook Pro 2019/ 2,3 GHz 8 Çekirdekli Intel Core i9 / AMD Radeon RX 6800 XT 16 GB / 32 GB 2667 MHz DDR4 Btw I just tried RC version of 4.1.0, but there is no improvement on the horizon...
ZeeshanYousuf commented 2024-03-14 10:48:28 +01:00
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For reference, I was unable to reproduce this on macOS 14.3 with a AMD Radeon W6800X.

@brecht & devs, I really appreciate the efforts you guys are going through to run blender, but DoF is one of the most important features on CGI software, and it’s been many months since I’ve been able to use DoF (I’ve had to “fake it” by applying filters/masks on Adobe Premiere Pro which has been an awful experience). On every single Mac I’ve encountered, 3 personal machines, and 6 other Intel/AMD Macs of fellow CG artists, I’ve been able to reproduce this issue, by simply making a default cube file, turning on DoF and adjusting focus until bokeh should appear, but instead the application either crashes or freezes.

If there’s any way I can help, either by jumping on a call, or reproducing the error and recording it, etc, let me know decs. I have a computer science background so I might be of use in that respect as well, although this software backend stuff is pretty complicated so I’m not sure. Either way, I am determined to see this issue fixed!

> For reference, I was unable to reproduce this on macOS 14.3 with a AMD Radeon W6800X. @brecht & devs, I really appreciate the efforts you guys are going through to run blender, but DoF is one of the most important features on CGI software, and it’s been many months since I’ve been able to use DoF (I’ve had to “fake it” by applying filters/masks on Adobe Premiere Pro which has been an awful experience). On every single Mac I’ve encountered, 3 personal machines, and 6 other Intel/AMD Macs of fellow CG artists, I’ve been able to reproduce this issue, by simply making a default cube file, turning on DoF and adjusting focus until bokeh should appear, but instead the application either crashes or freezes. If there’s any way I can help, either by jumping on a call, or reproducing the error and recording it, etc, let me know decs. I have a computer science background so I might be of use in that respect as well, although this software backend stuff is pretty complicated so I’m not sure. Either way, I am determined to see this issue fixed!
❤️ 1
Michael Parkin-White commented 2024-03-14 13:00:30 +01:00
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To at least attempt to make progress on this while the exact setup has not been reproducible, I will create an experimental branch and see if we can validate any of these potential ideas on failing configs. I'll link the PR here and see if the build-bot build has any change in characteristics.

Equally, as fixes are constantly landing at the driver/OS level, I'm curious whether macOS 14.4 mitigates any of these issues?

To at least attempt to make progress on this while the exact setup has not been reproducible, I will create an experimental branch and see if we can validate any of these potential ideas on failing configs. I'll link the PR here and see if the build-bot build has any change in characteristics. Equally, as fixes are constantly landing at the driver/OS level, I'm curious whether macOS 14.4 mitigates any of these issues?
Michael Parkin-White commented 2024-03-14 13:12:06 +01:00
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If anyone is able to verify whether this PR has any impact would be fantastic: #119457

Thank you!

If anyone is able to verify whether this PR has any impact would be fantastic: https://projects.blender.org/blender/blender/pulls/119457 Thank you!
Andrew commented 2024-03-14 16:07:07 +01:00
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Equally, as fixes are constantly landing at the driver/OS level, I'm curious whether macOS 14.4 mitigates any of these issues?

I just updated my iMac to 14.4. and the issue is FIXED! 🎉 (On my end at least)

Built a default scene, added an 0.0001 f-stop to the camera, and the viewport isn't lagging at all!

I will run some more tests in the meantime. Hopefully others will have the same success as I did.

> Equally, as fixes are constantly landing at the driver/OS level, I'm curious whether macOS 14.4 mitigates any of these issues? I just updated my iMac to 14.4. and the issue is FIXED! 🎉 (On my end at least) Built a default scene, added an 0.0001 f-stop to the camera, and the viewport isn't lagging at all! I will run some more tests in the meantime. Hopefully others will have the same success as I did.
Brecht Van Lommel commented 2024-03-18 13:28:53 +01:00
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@ZeeshanYousuf, @alperozgunyesil, can you confirm if the issue has been fixed in macOS 14.4?

@ZeeshanYousuf, @alperozgunyesil, can you confirm if the issue has been fixed in macOS 14.4?
ZeeshanYousuf commented 2024-03-18 13:51:05 +01:00
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@brecht I can confirm that life is great and DoF works again.

Thank you all and god bless

@brecht I can confirm that life is great and DoF works again. Thank you all and god bless
Brecht Van Lommel commented 2024-03-18 13:56:23 +01:00
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Thanks, let's consider this resolved then.

Thanks, let's consider this resolved then.
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